Jerry-ADK
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Post by Jerry-ADK on Dec 30, 2013 18:48:09 GMT -5
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Dec 30, 2013 21:18:56 GMT -5
It makes absolutely no sense to me for a spherical projectile. Sounds like a major gimmick item. Additional airflow around the BB but how that would be a significant positive influence is beyond me.
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shiftysgarand
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Post by shiftysgarand on Dec 31, 2013 15:37:12 GMT -5
Apparently it functions somewhat similar to the TK Twist barrel, but doesn't have the 1 joule restriction. They also make one for the ICS Garand.
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Post by iamthedevil on Dec 31, 2013 16:28:34 GMT -5
i may buy one soon, my inner barrel got bent when redoing my stock. dont ask. when i do ill give my thoughts/results.
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Jerry-ADK
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Post by Jerry-ADK on Dec 31, 2013 18:14:29 GMT -5
i may buy one soon, my inner barrel got bent when redoing my stock. dont ask. when i do ill give my thoughts/results. All right, I'll be interested to hear how it works. Do you use a hop with this kind of barrel? Seems like putting a backspin on the projectile would be counter productive to what the rifling is trying to do. Thanks, Jer
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Dec 31, 2013 19:04:55 GMT -5
As I understand it rifling is a bit misleading as a description of this design. When I think of rifling I thing of twisted grooves that cause the projectile to spin. apparently this has linear grooves the length of the barrel that allow the Bb to float down the barrel. It all sounds like silliness to me.
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Jerry-ADK
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Post by Jerry-ADK on Jan 1, 2014 10:16:53 GMT -5
As I understand it rifling is a bit misleading as a description of this design. When I think of rifling I thing of twisted grooves that cause the projectile to spin. apparently this has linear grooves the length of the barrel that allow the Bb to float down the barrel. It all sounds like silliness to me. Thanks 2nd Bat, That is misleading. I was thinking spiral rifling. They don't do anything to explain their product, at least not that I can find. If the grooves are in straight rows down the barrel, the bb would probably come out of the barrel without any spin, much like throwing a knuckle ball. Not sure what that would do for accuracy, probably nothing. I wonder why they would go through the trouble to produce such a barrel, if not for just a gimmick to sell stuff. Probably the best upgrade barrel for the Kar98 would be a tight bore if any. But most of these guns of the Tanaka clone verity probably shoot pretty darn good right out of the box. Happy New Years! See you in a couple of weeks, Jer
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jan 1, 2014 11:40:50 GMT -5
A tight barrel is the only barrel accessory that makes any sense to me and the effects are fairly minimal even then. With airsoft guns you have to mindful of so many factors that effect trying to get a round ball that doesn't weigh much to fly straight. Pretty tough actually. Airsoft guns (especially today) do an amazong job. I had airsoft guns in the early 80s and I have to say things have really come along way. Hop up is without a doubt the single most important enhancement and AEGs are right up there as well.
With all airsoft guns (especially gas) you have to be aware of a thing called barrel suck. Theoretically the longer and tighter the barrel the better your range and accuracy should be but there is actually a point of deminishing return where the vacume behind the bb flying down the barrel actually impedes the inertia. Perhaps this "rifled" barrel uses the tiny grooves to offset barrel suck and allows for an otherwise tighter longer barrel then you would normally be able to get away with? It is the only thing that in my limited pea brain makes any sense.
Physics was never my strong suit. It is amazing how much math, geometry, and physics there is in airsoft. See you in a few weeks. I may join you the night prior if nothing else to get a Head start on issuing out costumes and gear.
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Jerry-ADK
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Post by Jerry-ADK on Jan 1, 2014 17:40:17 GMT -5
Sounds good, I'll PM you about staying with me and how to find the place.
All the physics you've mentioned thus far seem sound. I'm no Einstein myself, but thinking about the mechanics of a vacuum inside a bottle may be a good comparison. For instance, when you pull on a cork, it pulls against you until you break the seal with the bottle, much the same way a BB is traveling down a tight barrel tube. I can see how that may create a seal and vacuum behind it like a cork and a bottle would. Some reliving somewhere would have to compensate for it. I just wonder if there has been any testing of such barrels to see if it does neutralize this back pressure to gain velocity.
It seems like there is allot to what makes a good airsoft gun and I am learning something new here everyday. Its always fun to start tinkering with things, to make it better. In my experience so far airsoft guns have many quirks and flaws and upgrading can go along way to making a good gun better. I completely changed a open bolt WE Tech SCAR GBB to a closed bolt system. Changed the gun from the cqb barrel to a long steel tighter bore. And I upgraded the hop up to A+60. Some grinding and gluing later...I got a gun that works and that is pretty dangerous out to about 300 feet.(she's a GBB though, pretty darn bitchy sometimes, especially when the ambient temp is below 60). But it was fun to do, and I learned a little about something I didn't know about.
I would like to see a good bolt action system that was spring fired and used a low cap removable magazine instead of single cartridges that eject. I have seen custom builds on the forum of converted springers to old Kar98 stocks. But I wonder what it would take to prompt the airsoft world to manufacture a springer bolt action system that could be used for all models of ww2 bolt action airsoft rifles. A spring fired system seems so much easier to build than a gas system and therefore way less expensive and wouldn't have the drawback that gas has with leaks, and freezing. The rifle squad is the backbone of WW2 infantry. If we could get more rifles on the field cheaply that would be awesome. It would really help distinguish WW2 airsoft from regular airsoft.
Sorry I went a bit off topic there, but for what ever it is worth, its nice to ponder such topics.
Cheers and safe travels,
Jer
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jan 2, 2014 14:19:11 GMT -5
Indeed currently the need for an inexpensive but effective airsoft gun representing the primary (or commonplace) rifles of the main belligerants seems like a no brainer. Essentially the VSR type springer set up with the right cosmetics. No shells, no gas no reverse cock silliness. It just seems like a demand that could fairly easily be filled. The nicely done and super inexpensive CYMa/UKARMS carbine demonstrates that such a thing is possible. Like the assorted VSR sringers the bolt action mechanism could facilitate a stronger spring then the lottle carbines and should support 400 to 450 FPS withoit over accessive cocking effort.
Imagine if we had Kar 98s, Arisakas, Mosin Nagants and Springfields for under $100.00
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Jerry-ADK
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Post by Jerry-ADK on Jan 2, 2014 19:11:25 GMT -5
Indeed currently the need for an inexpensive but effective airsoft gun representing the primary (or commonplace) rifles of the main belligerants seems like a no brainer. Essentially the VSR type springer set up with the right cosmetics. No shells, no gas no reverse cock silliness. It just seems like a demand that could fairly easily be filled. The nicely done and super inexpensive CYMa/UKARMS carbine demonstrates that such a thing is possible. Like the assorted VSR sringers the bolt action mechanism could facilitate a stronger spring then the lottle carbines and should support 400 to 450 FPS withoit over accessive cocking effort. Imagine if we had Kar 98s, Arisakas, Mosin Nagants and Springfields for under $100.00 I bet if someone made one the market would be pretty big if you consider WW2 airsoft is happening all around the world. It does seem like a "no-brainier" to me as well. Any rumors of such a gun being developed? It's perplexing why airsoft gun manufacturers have not done it. Maybe WW2 airsoft players should really start calling for it. I'd buy one at whatever price they ask.
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Post by brownien on Jan 2, 2014 19:34:08 GMT -5
With all the Vsr type sniper rifles out there already, and seeing how most kids getting into airsoft flip their lids at the thought of being a sniper; any airsoft company who builds and sells any of the main battle rifles from ww2, are going to sell tons of them, especially if they offer period scopes for them. Most airsoft retailers already tag most ww2 battle rifles on their sites as sniper rifles anyway. For the big companies, it's all about making money, and if they can build a ww2 gun for cheap and make money they will.
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Jerry-ADK
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Post by Jerry-ADK on Jan 2, 2014 20:55:56 GMT -5
With all the Vsr type sniper rifles out there already, and seeing how most kids getting into airsoft flip their lids at the thought of being a sniper; any airsoft company who builds and sells any of the main battle rifles from ww2, are going to sell tons of them, especially if they offer period scopes for them. Most airsoft retailers already tag most ww2 battle rifles on their sites as sniper rifles anyway. For the big companies, it's all about making money, and if they can build a ww2 gun for cheap and make money they will. That would be great if they would, cause we know they can. May be its just a matter of time. There're making more affordable MG42's now, so they must know there is a huge market for WW2 enthusiasts.
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shiftysgarand
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Post by shiftysgarand on Jan 2, 2014 21:02:47 GMT -5
Indeed currently the need for an inexpensive but effective airsoft gun representing the primary (or commonplace) rifles of the main belligerants seems like a no brainer. Essentially the VSR type springer set up with the right cosmetics. No shells, no gas no reverse cock silliness. It just seems like a demand that could fairly easily be filled. The nicely done and super inexpensive CYMa/UKARMS carbine demonstrates that such a thing is possible. Like the assorted VSR sringers the bolt action mechanism could facilitate a stronger spring then the lottle carbines and should support 400 to 450 FPS withoit over accessive cocking effort. Imagine if we had Kar 98s, Arisakas, Mosin Nagants and Springfields for under $100.00 I bet if someone made one the market would be pretty big if you consider WW2 airsoft is happening all around the world. It does seem like a "no-brainier" to me as well. Any rumors of such a gun being developed? It's perplexing why airsoft gun manufacturers have not done it. Maybe WW2 airsoft players should really start calling for it. I'd buy one at whatever price they ask. There's an ACM Garand rumored. It looks exactly like a Marushin though, and as of now. It's just vapor ware.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jan 3, 2014 0:42:16 GMT -5
If the ICS Garand AEG and the GnG Garand (assuming it ever actually gets built) are successful (and I believe they will be) and ACM knock off is only a matter of time. The manufacturers need to be told that a visually proper bolt action rifle would be a big hit. Cosmetically if it coud be on parr with the cheap carbine and functionally equal to the cheap VSRs it would be fabulous. No reason other then the tens of thousands in initial set up costs why this couldn't be done.
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Post by alinz90 on Aug 14, 2014 0:44:10 GMT -5
Speaking of g&g they might make an stg44 and g43 if enough people want them
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Aug 14, 2014 6:53:19 GMT -5
At this point with Gng hyping the imminent release of their Garand AEG three years ago (and still nothing to show for it) they are at the top of the list of "Vaporware merchants.". Anything they say or are rumored to be offering soon means NOTHING! Thats true for all munufactures but especially GnG.
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Post by LϟϟAH1944 on Aug 14, 2014 22:50:16 GMT -5
Exactly. Don't expect companies to make what they say. Take the AGm Mg42 for example...
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stuka
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Post by stuka on Aug 14, 2014 23:52:00 GMT -5
well isn't the matrix the agm?Everywhere else I have seen it, I am pretty sure it is marked as agm
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