TommyGunner
Staff Sgt.
Hackjob Mauro
1st Marine Division, 1942
Posts: 2,265
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Post by TommyGunner on Dec 31, 2007 21:30:36 GMT -5
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Post by KippySmi7h on Dec 31, 2007 21:45:44 GMT -5
Damn! How much does that thing weigh. They cant be serious about that.
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Sgt_Tom
Technical Sgt.
Combat!
Posts: 3,580
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Jan 1, 2008 10:56:23 GMT -5
:oHow much does it weigh. I guess soldiers will be dropping dead on the battlefield because of weight stress. Just kidding. ;D
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dave
Private
"I've heard that you're a lowdown yankee liar."
Posts: 52
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Post by dave on Jan 1, 2008 10:59:02 GMT -5
If anyone here is planning on joining the armed forces they better start lifting weights. ;D
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Post by airsoftaddict on Jan 1, 2008 12:08:14 GMT -5
dat ting is s0o 1337
sorry, had to be done
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sharpshooter
Private 1st Class
"Shoot anything that moves and if it screams in German...shoot it again"
Posts: 510
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Post by sharpshooter on Jan 1, 2008 16:52:22 GMT -5
Umm... this was a joke fellas.............and a DAMN funny one at that! ;D ;D
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YankeeDiv26
Staff Sgt.
Frustrated Mac Owner
BDM<33
Posts: 2,462
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Post by YankeeDiv26 on Jan 1, 2008 17:00:01 GMT -5
LOL. All of those optics probably would limit a soldiers periphial vision to nothing. This actually reminds me of the "landwarrior" system that was (and still may be) being developed by the army. I remember a picture of it showing all kinds of RIS, sights, optics, lights, fuzzy dice, ect. ect. on an m4, and there being a bayonet on it. As if you'd be able to stab anyone/thing with all that extra stuff on.
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Post by Tough Ombre on Jan 1, 2008 17:42:28 GMT -5
The Land warrior system is actually being used now. The 2nd ID was actually the first to be trained to use it on their rotation back to the states . I got to hold a dummy rifle with the real system on it at a US army trailer at the Nascar race here in Chicago, and it was surprisingly light. It was working too as i was able to play around with it. Its COMPLETELY different then the original prototype, they had one of those on display, and that thing was HUGE. But like i said the whole thing seemed surprisingly light. Here is a picture of the Original Prototype. www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/images/land-warrior-lwc.jpgAnd here is what they are currently using, still looks bulky, but not bad, like i said earlier. www.news.com/i/bto/20070608/Land_Warrior_540x389.jpgThe worst is this nsc.natick.army.mil/media/fact/individual/FW.jpgIts called NSC or Future Warrior. I absolutely hate the thing, and think that there are WAY better ways for the military to spend their money. They are trying to make it so that little pistol thing will replace the m16 and m4 and the whole suit will change colors depending on the environment, using little cameras in the helmet. And the entire suit will be made out of a material that once a force is pressed upon it focus all its energy to that point to stop the projectile, (kinda hard to explain) and if it does penetrate the suit will put pressure on the wound and stop the bleeding. I honestly think they want the thing to do too much, and will just waste money on it trying to get a prototype, and then wont be happy with it and the same situation of the Comanche Helicopter will happen. Anyways, that gun does look crazy haha, with all that BS on it. I think if i saw a fellow soldier with that much on it i would slap em. -Cary
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Post by binarypunisher on Jan 1, 2008 19:02:34 GMT -5
I am pretty sure they are just developing concepts, they arent expecting people to deploy with all that applesauce .
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Post by Tough Ombre on Jan 1, 2008 20:54:52 GMT -5
The NSC the are already pouring money into as they want it ready for minimal testing by 2012. The Land Warrior is being used. -Cary
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guitarmaster
Corporal
And at this range, I'm a real Frederick Zoller
Posts: 954
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Post by guitarmaster on Jan 1, 2008 21:09:38 GMT -5
wI am not going to join the military if they start making them look like "PowerRangers"
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Post by binarypunisher on Jan 1, 2008 21:18:12 GMT -5
Of course its being used, but is it being used OCONUS? Is it being used by deployed soldiers?
I doubt it.
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YankeeDiv26
Staff Sgt.
Frustrated Mac Owner
BDM<33
Posts: 2,462
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Post by YankeeDiv26 on Jan 1, 2008 21:26:12 GMT -5
haha. yep Cary thats the landwarrior I was thinking about. The picture even has the bayonet. I remember seeing it on a history channel show a while back.
Now that new landwarrior setup looks like it may be actually practical, mabye they can justify some of the extra weight because of the regular deployment of troops being different today (ie. helecopter or ground vehecile as opposed to mostly long-distance marches). If they make it simple enough, practical enough, and light enough, I don't know why the average GI wouldn't accept it.
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guitarmaster
Corporal
And at this range, I'm a real Frederick Zoller
Posts: 954
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Post by guitarmaster on Jan 1, 2008 21:29:56 GMT -5
They don't wanna look like they were designed by the SciFi channel/
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TommyGunner
Staff Sgt.
Hackjob Mauro
1st Marine Division, 1942
Posts: 2,265
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Post by TommyGunner on Jan 2, 2008 0:59:41 GMT -5
I personally think that all you need are good old iron sights and a radio. Thats it.....maybe night vision goggles....and a dragon armor bulle proof vest....ad a lazer sight...maybe a hud display too on an electronic helmet, ohoh and that new digital cammo uniform..oh and maybe some...........hmmm yeah iron sights..plus some other fun things. lol
TommyGunner
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Post by Tough Ombre on Jan 2, 2008 1:43:08 GMT -5
Binary, From everything that i have been told it is currently being deployed in Iraq.
Yankeediv, i totally agree. The things that it does FAR outweigh any problems with it being heavier. You can send and receive photos of people you maybe be looking for, you have constant maps and updates on your HUD, the radio transmitions, you can receive live feed from UAV's that may be circling the combat zone, you can even instant message orders and stuff of that such, what it can do is endless.
-Cary
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Post by binarypunisher on Jan 2, 2008 5:09:51 GMT -5
I bet some parts of the Landwarrior system are in use...but the Land Warrior system as a whole? I highly doubt it.
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Post by Tough Ombre on Jan 2, 2008 12:33:45 GMT -5
There is no "parts" to it being used. Its either all or nothing. I can also tell you for a fact that it is currently deployed in Iraq with the 2nd ID, I went and did more research after you kept questioning what i have been told. Mostly all the articles i read said it was deployed in Iraq with the 2nd ID. Do a Google search on it. and read up if you still don't believe me and want to question what i know some more. As you have kind of dug yourself into a hole here.
Now i will say at one point the system was canceled that was in mid 2006, but congress forced the Military to take a second look at it, and they did, they had the system refurbished in Early 2007 and that is what is being used now.
-Cary
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Post by Jager.Drü on Jan 2, 2008 15:31:19 GMT -5
Are you kidding. Are you in the military? Are you over there inside the ins and outs? I highly doubt that they are using it in any sort of combat. It could be over in Iraq but only being used on base for training.
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YankeeDiv26
Staff Sgt.
Frustrated Mac Owner
BDM<33
Posts: 2,462
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Post by YankeeDiv26 on Jan 2, 2008 15:58:03 GMT -5
Are you kidding. Are you in the military? Are you over there inside the ins and outs? I highly doubt that they are using it in any sort of combat. It could be over in Iraq but only being used on base for training. You don't have to be in the military to know about the military. If that mantra were true then anybody who wasn't involved WWII would know nothing about it It is in for a fact in Iraq. After just a few minutes of online research I quote from an article. " Soldiers from the Army’s 2nd Infantry Division, 4th Battalion, 9th Infantry Regiment, out of Fort Lewis, Washington, are the first troops to take the Land Warrior and Mounted Warrior systems into combat, employing them in support of operation Iraqi Freedom" also. "The Army has 232 Land Warrior systems and 140 Mounted Warrior systems currently in Iraq. The systems have been in theater since April, and the regiment is using them in every mission" Here's a link to one of the good articles I found on the subject. Pictures too, and in my opinion it looks like they're in the typical Iraqi combat zone. www.afcea.org/signal/articles/templates/Signal_Article_Template.asp?articleid=1413&zoneid=219Not happy with the information provided? Do some research and prove me wrong. I never mind being wrong, just as long as the other guy is right.
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Post by 101steasykid on Jan 2, 2008 16:03:21 GMT -5
Pwned
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Post by Jager.Drü on Jan 2, 2008 16:12:30 GMT -5
Thats the last time I back Brian up. tight...not Was right about one thing, not every boot on the ground has one. Just one company.
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Post by binarypunisher on Jan 2, 2008 16:39:35 GMT -5
I personally think that all you need are good old iron sights and a radio. Thats it.....maybe night vision goggles....and a dragon armor bulle proof vest....ad a lazer sight...maybe a hud display too on an electronic helmet, ohoh and that new digital cammo uniform..oh and maybe some...........hmmm yeah iron sights..plus some other fun things. lol TommyGunner Wow. 1. Dragonskin is awesome armor if you like armor that doesnt work very well. 2. If you can have optics on a rifle - why not have them? They aid target aquisition, and can give you that extra boost in range. There is no "parts" to it being used. Its either all or nothing. They arent using the weapon. But other than that, yeah I am wrong - heh, theres a first time for everything.
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YankeeDiv26
Staff Sgt.
Frustrated Mac Owner
BDM<33
Posts: 2,462
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Post by YankeeDiv26 on Jan 2, 2008 16:50:12 GMT -5
Binarypunisher. I think Tommygunner was just making a joke.
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KRaddatz
Private 1st Class
505th
Posts: 589
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Post by KRaddatz on Jan 3, 2008 19:01:20 GMT -5
Wow. 1. Dragonskin is awesome armor if you like armor that doesnt work very well. Yeah its so bad the secret service uses it, swat teams, 9 generals in Afghanistan and general's bodyguards. better than the interceptor.
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Post by binarypunisher on Jan 3, 2008 20:34:13 GMT -5
Wow. 1. Dragonskin is awesome armor if you like armor that doesnt work very well. Yeah its so bad the secret service uses it, swat teams, 9 generals in Afghanistan and general's bodyguards. better than the interceptor. Which explains why it FAILED the NIJs tests? Dragonskin is awesome armor if you like armor that when it gets hot, the glue melts causing the scales to shift and change position. This in turn creates holes in the armor, where if you are shot a bullet will penetrate. Dragonskin is a neat idea, its too bad the company and the owner are scumbags. They are scumbags because: 1. The company has been known to put counterfeit NIJ certification labels on armor sold to the Air Force. 2. Accusing the Army of rigging live fire tests 3. General poor conduct If you want me to give you sources on all this I can, but I wouldnt use Dragonskin if someone paid me. The interceptor works, it may be uncomfortable - but it works. No one disputes that.
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YankeeDiv26
Staff Sgt.
Frustrated Mac Owner
BDM<33
Posts: 2,462
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Post by YankeeDiv26 on Jan 3, 2008 21:59:25 GMT -5
Though I don't know much (if really anything) on the subject of Dragonskin, remember that there is a slight possibility that the military are the ones who could be rigging or changing the opinion on dragonskin behind the scenes. The introduction of the M16 being one of these issues. There was a strong dislike of it from the higher-ups which trickled down to the army ACTUALLY rigging tests (I believe it happened during a cold-weather test on a base in Alaska), and intentionally trying to sabotage the project in order to drown it. May be the same type of deal with Dragonskin. I'm not really trying to make a point out of this, but it's just food for thought.
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Post by binarypunisher on Jan 3, 2008 22:08:08 GMT -5
I can understand why the Army didnt like the M16 - it was forced down their throats my McNamara and his whiz kids. IIRC, I think the M16 actually failed some of the trials - but it passed in the political arena, and thats all that matters.
The Army didnt do the tests, the Department of Justice did.
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Post by Tough Ombre on Jan 4, 2008 2:02:45 GMT -5
Well, since what i wrote was close to the wiki article which Binary pointed out to me, i figure i will just post the link to that instead ;-) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M16_rifle-Cary
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Post by waldo on Jan 4, 2008 2:17:03 GMT -5
I had read an article in the newspaper that stated that members of the corporation that produces Interceptor vests wanted more testing done on Dragon Skin, alongside Interceptor vests. This seemed to be one of the principal reasons why the new vest was not going into full indoctrination of the Armed Forces.
Nick
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