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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 7:54:36 GMT -5
By now, everyone is familiar with the AEG M14 and it’s reliability. Many other builders have built M1's out of their M14's and I believe 2nd Bat was one of the first and has dozens of M1's under his belt by now. This build has had it’s problems, including making the stock look like an original and the mag. I can’t remember the fellow who finally came up with a decent solution, for the mag, but I believe he is in Europe. His shotgun mag was a brilliant solution. Much copied now and “much improved” on. But, he came up with it first. What I have done here is a replication of others work, but I don’t remember ever seeing a “mini tutorial” of turning an M14 into a M1 Garand using the original wood stock and I am sure this is the first AEG M1 Garand with self eject. I have seen one other AEG M1 using the shotgun mags I have used, but this fellow tied a string around them to pull them out of the gun when empty. My shells are automatically ejected when the bolt is pulled back. So, I don’t care what you come up with, someone is going to “improve” it I have a thread with my work regarding this M1, but I was not satisfied with the photos and I wanted to show a bit more detail on the construction and defiantly the self eject. Without further ado, this is what I started with and ended up with. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 7:55:34 GMT -5
These are the shells I wanted to use. [/img] Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 7:56:38 GMT -5
These next two photos will show the amount of wood that must be removed from the stock. By the time you are done about all you will have will be a shell. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 7:57:16 GMT -5
Final stock photo Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 7:58:13 GMT -5
These are some of the bits I used in boring out this stock. The longest bit was used to bore out the barrel. To cut thru the handgrip area I started with a 3/8" x 18" long bit. Then I used a 1" bit with an extension. To cut out the rear of the stock I used a 1" bit and finished up with a 1" belt sander. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 7:59:23 GMT -5
Here are all of the various bits and pieces you will need to build your AEG M1 Garand. AEG M14 $150. Original wood stock Ebay $65 All of metal stock parts $60. Gas assembly $45. Misc $35. So, by the time you get everything together you will have a minimum of $355 in it unless you get lucky and stumble across some really cheap stuff. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 8:01:50 GMT -5
Lets talk about the barrel for a min. What I am doing here is VERY ILLEGAL in many countries. If you live someplace where they have laws regarding this, DO NOT DO IT. I’m not looking to get anyone in trouble here. Be sure to check your local laws regarding using pressure parts. Where I live we cannot use the receiver, but we can use old barrels and gas assemblies. If you live in an area where this is forbidden you can purchase look alike components from suppliers and that would be the thing to do. I’m not going on any more about the law. You know what your local laws are or it would be best for you to find out before any builds to replicate old firearms. Enough said. The AEG M14 comes with an aluminum barrel that is simply too short to work with the M1 Garand set up. Some guys simply use that barrel and leave it short and disguise it. I suppose one could cut a piece of aluminum tubing to hold the hopup in place and extend the aluminum barrel a bit, but the brass tube will still be short. Not a good solution here without buying a longer brass barrel. You can, but I ain’t gonna pay that kind of money for an inch and a half of brass tubing. What I finally ended up doing was to purchase some old shot out M1 Garand barrels. Then I drilled out the rifling (it was already shot out). To do that drilling, I purchased a 3/8" concrete bit and sharpened it. (Very sharp) Then I silver soldered a length of 1/4" steel rod to it. For actual drilling I needed to run at very low speed and keep it cooled with water. I put a bucket of water over head and then put a piece of 1/4" plastic tubing in it and used this tubing to bring water into the barrel. The end I was drilling from was the low point so I put a piece of plastic on the steel rod to keep water from entering the drill. It worked like a champ and drilled out the barrel. So, at this point I have a drilled out M1 Garand barrel that is way too huge to go into the receiver on the M14. I don’t have access to a lathe so I had to farm this work out. He did a fine job and returned a barrel to me that would slide right over the inner brass barrel and lock into the M14 receiver. I simply cut it to length. All of this sounds very easy to do, but I had forgotten what I learned many years ago about drilling hard steel. I had to relearn that process and that took some time, but once I learned I was able to drill it out fairly quickly. Here are those barrels. 1 An original M1 Garand barrel. 2 The aluminum outer barrel for the M14 3 The turned down bored out M1 Garand barrel installed in the AEG M14 receiver. 4 An original M1 Garand gas assembly. That piece of steel tubing is to represent the rod that blows back to operate the firing cycle on an original M1. So, when you read where people say that the opening under the forward stock is open with nothing in it, they are wrong. Let me point out something here. You will notice how short the spring holder is on the AEG M14. The reason being that it would actually pop out past the end of the M1 Garand stock if left full length. I cut mine to the point that it would be a 1/4 shy of popping out. That left me with the problem of the spring holder pulling out of the clamp that holds it under the barrel. To solve that problem I turned that clamp upside down and then bored out the portion that normally clamps onto the barrel. Now it slides up and down the barrel but is fixed onto the spring holder. Works great. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 8:05:57 GMT -5
I’m going to put in this shot of the magazine area to give a bit more detail on the self ejecting part of this rifle. #3 is simply a piece of magazine side plate from some old K98 parts from the junk bin. This holds the ejector rod (#1) in position and the opening for #4 keeps the ejector rod from going too far forward. When that ejector rod is forced back by the pull lever on the rifle it kicks down the cam (#2) and ejects the shell. You can see how everything fits into the mag area of the M14 and (I think) it makes a bit neater job on the M1 Garand build. In any case, it is so nice to be able to eject the shell at the end of the firing cycle. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 8:07:25 GMT -5
Here are the shotgun shells. As you can see, these are the cheap, readily available shells they keep pumping out for the plastic shotguns. They can be easily cut with a scroll, band or hand saw. Gluing them back together is done with Super Glue or any of a dozen plastic glues. The shell comes 70mm long and they need to be about 54-56mm long. I do this by cutting out 14-16mm of the center and gluing them back together. You have a lot of leeway on the actual length because of the locking lever on the M14 mag. It will allow you push the shell forward if necessary and it kicks back out of the way when you eject. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 8:08:40 GMT -5
This is what you want to end up with. A shell that is approx 54-56mm long. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 8:10:19 GMT -5
Here are all of the bits and pieces for the self-eject feature. I'm not going to give any sizes. It's simply what works for you. Let me start with the components. In the first and 2nd photos you will see the various parts. It's really simple. Part 1 is a piece of plumbers elbow. Note the very small hole just under the top edge. Look carefully and you will see that a wire is wrapped around it and goes into the hole. When this wire gets into the area the BB goes thru it is looped back down and that will enable a BB to go into the gun, but will not let it fall back out. Part 2 is the cradle the shotgun shells rests in and it has a cam that goes into a rectangular hole and rides on part 3. When part 3 (actuator rod) is pushed back against part 2 it will create enough force that the shotgun shell will be kicked straight up 3 to 4 inches. Of course, in the gun it will be straight down. Part 4 are the springs that pull the cam/cradle and the actuator rod back into position. The actuator rod is made from 3/16s square rod. I filed and sanded it until it would fit the grove on the side of the receiver. I never measured the length. I filed one end into a ramp shape to lift the cam and then placed it on the magazine and made a mark at about where I thought it should be bent. The spring pin on the side was made from a broken tool for the dremel. You don’t have to be exact here. There is a lot of leeway in length and other dimensions. The BB feed tube is simply 5/16s plumbers elbow. I bent a piece of brass in an L shape and drilled two holes in it and then JB welded it into position. After the JB set I used a dremel to cut out a latch area so it could lock in where the magazine would normally fit. Part 2 is probably the most creative part. I used a piece of copper tubing that I hammered flat and then formed into a curve to accept screws to hold it in position. Then I bent a small piece of brass stock into an L shape and soldered a piece of steel onto the side to act as a cam lifter. Then I epoxied both pieces together. After they were locked together I filed out the area where the shotgun shell would go but made sure it was almost touching the brass. This would give me the best cam action to kick out the shell. The springs are readily available at any hardware store. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 8:12:01 GMT -5
To finish this up I am going to show some shots of the M1 in various poses and then the finished gun. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 8:13:09 GMT -5
And this is what I ended up with. Attachments:
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 8:34:54 GMT -5
I would like to say something regarding using an original wood stocked AEG M1 in games. I wouldn't do it. By the time you are done you will have a substancial investment in the gun and if you were to slip or drop the gun I could just about guarantee that you will end up with a broken gun. If you want to use it for display thats fine and if one were to remove the wood stock and install the original plastic stock for the games that would work too. I would just hate to see someone put a lot of time and effort into one of these only to break it. Anyway, all of that is up to you. Good luck with your gun PS. Any questions, I will do the best I can. You can either ask in the forum or PM.
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Sgt_Tom
Technical Sgt.
Combat!
Posts: 3,580
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Mar 19, 2012 13:44:32 GMT -5
Really genius idea! How far do you have to pull back the bolt to release the shotgun shell? I'll probably try this someday when I get around to finishing my Garand conversion .
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 14:44:50 GMT -5
Thank you sgttom. You can set the pull to what ever suits you. For mine I wanted it to be as natural as possible so I set it eject about 1 1/2" before the end of the pull. The pull still goes to the end, but the shell is ejected just before. It's really simple to work with and I bet a dollar to a dougnut hole that it can be used to eject the mags that most of the guys are using right now. Now, if we can just figure a way to get the ping sound
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 19, 2012 14:49:01 GMT -5
sgttom. Let me say this. The actuator rod that pushes the cam to eject the shell will continue to slide past the cam when the shell is ejected. When you get ready for this part with your M1 let me know and I will take off the slide plate and walk this gun thru it's steps frame by frame.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Mar 24, 2012 16:16:10 GMT -5
This is an absolute condidate for a sticky for all to see and use as a tutorial. Thank you for sharing. Anything that gets more Garands out on an airsoft field is a big plus in my book. Very very clever. The neck area on many stocks will not actually provide enough thickness and those that do as mentioned above leave a paper thin wall around the motor and virtually no room for reinforcement so as stated if you decide to go that route don't expect the gun to hold up to field use and be advised that depending on the period and manufacturer of the actual stock it might not even be possible to use with an M14 base rifle. I thought all Garand stocks would be uniform is size but they are not.
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 29, 2012 13:26:27 GMT -5
The reason I am doing this in a separate thread is because I believe the self eject part of my M1 Garand build can be used with the magazines being used in most of these builds. In any case I have found a way to put the bottom plate cover on an AEG M1 Garand to make it more realistic. With this plate in postion the AEG M1 Garand is virtually the same as the original from the side or bottom shot. The first photo shows an arrow to the hinge. When the shell is ejected the bottom plate pops open and the shell falls from the rifle. It's a simple matter to pop in another shell and snap the plate back into position. You don't have to line up anything for it to snap back. The hinge holds it in proper alignment and it is held in postion with a magnet. That is pointed out in the 2nd photo. When I started this build it was my desire to make a rifle as close in appearance to a "real steel" M1 Garand as possible. I have used several real steel parts, but all of those parts can be replaced with look alike parts to meet your obligations to the law. This post will be added to the "mini tutorial" for those wanting to see the eject system. [/img] Attachments:
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Mar 29, 2012 14:02:51 GMT -5
Amazing work as usual! I was thinking on doing something similar to this. I didn't think of using a magnet though.
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 29, 2012 14:18:00 GMT -5
Thanks sgttom. The magnet is one that is readily availiable at almost all hardware stores. They come in a pack of 6 or 7. I had no idea how strong they were and had thought to use a minimum of 2, but the one magnet will hold the plate firmly in postion even smacking the rifle around to attempt a dislodge. If you didn't even use the hinge you could put one magnet on either side and still hold the plate in position. The hinge came from a craft store. They wanted $6 or $7 bucks for a package of hinges, but you can buy one of their small wood boxes for $1.98 and it has two hinges on it
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 29, 2012 17:05:01 GMT -5
Oops, I left out these photos of the trigger assembly. Attachments:
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Mar 30, 2012 11:56:28 GMT -5
I am guessing you just glued that hinge on?
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Post by jettalewis on Mar 30, 2012 15:36:44 GMT -5
The hinge is screwed to the M14 trigger housing and epoxied to the real steel. To be quite frank with you I am not totally satisfied with the hinge itself. This weekend I will probably make a hinge out of some of the brass stock I have here and, hopefully, will be able to silver solder it to the real steel.
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Post by TheNewoob on Apr 1, 2012 7:32:12 GMT -5
Great job jettalewis, thank you for sharing. I have converted an m14 into M1 Garand, with all real steel except for the stock. My next project was to do all steel and wood stock, but came across the same problem that 2nd Bat talks about, and the amount of wood need to remove in the neck area to fit the motor. I've read over your write up and was curious how you addressed this ... basically to fit the motor in the neck without compromising the integrity of the neck.
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Post by jettalewis on Apr 2, 2012 8:34:26 GMT -5
Hi. You cannot make this gun without compromising the integrity of the neck. You have to remove so much wood that I actually shined a flashlight to see if it would show thru. I suppose you could coat it with some of the auto body fillers with fiberglass in it, but I doubt it will prove to be very helpful. Basically, this gun is to hang on a wall or use to show your skills. It's just not pratical.
sgttom, I reworked that hinge area. The avaliable hinge from the hobby/craft stores was just too thin and flimsy to stand up to a lot of use. What I did was to use some brass tubing I had here. I cut two equal legnths (about 3/4") I then silver soldered one legnth to the real steel floorplate and the other to a piece of flat brass stock I had. Then I place the two pieces side by side and clamped them to the floorplate. I used a very fine jewelers saw to cut out the hinge portions and finished them up with files. They came out perfect. Very strong, very slick. I am now, truly satisfied with the gun.
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Sgt_Tom
Technical Sgt.
Combat!
Posts: 3,580
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 2, 2012 9:17:44 GMT -5
Hi. You cannot make this gun without compromising the integrity of the neck. You have to remove so much wood that I actually shined a flashlight to see if it would show thru. I suppose you could coat it with some of the auto body fillers with fiberglass in it, but I doubt it will prove to be very helpful. Basically, this gun is to hang on a wall or use to show your skills. It's just not pratical. sgttom, I reworked that hinge area. The avaliable hinge from the hobby/craft stores was just too thin and flimsy to stand up to a lot of use. What I did was to use some brass tubing I had here. I cut two equal legnths (about 3/4") I then silver soldered one legnth to the real steel floorplate and the other to a piece of flat brass stock I had. Then I place the two pieces side by side and clamped them to the floorplate. I used a very fine jewelers saw to cut out the hinge portions and finished them up with files. They came out perfect. Very strong, very slick. I am now, truly satisfied with the gun. Very nice jettalewis, as far as the stock goes I believe they vary in thickness. Its possible you could get one that has a thicker neck. You could also attempt cutting the stock in down the middle then fill in the seams with body-filler to increase the space inside. Other then that making the stock from scratch is probably your best bet. I am just going to stick with my modified plastic stock. Do you plan to do up your plastic stock for gaming purposes?
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Apr 2, 2012 13:02:43 GMT -5
The issue with the stock neck is both thickness and to some degree height (depending on the stock itself. In any event you will either end up with a ruined stock, one with paper thin sides or a stock that has been slightly reshaped to some degree in order to work. The stocks made for the Greek army (post war) tend to be thicker through the neck I have found. On those few Garands that I built using wood stocks I laid fiberglass weave on the inside of the wood walls and glassed it into place. It definitely adds strength where it's needed.
All but one (out of roughly a dozen) have held up fine (to my knowledge) but I did have one customer say his split at the neck about two years after he got it. I have a couple all wood Garands and they both seem to be fine but I wouldn't run the bayonet course with them! All wood stocks are of course gorgeaous and authentic but a modified plastic stock is infinitely more practical and can be made to look quite good.
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Post by jettalewis on Apr 2, 2012 13:05:15 GMT -5
sgttom, your idea of spitting the stock down the middle would make it so much easier to work with. You could then glue it back together with a correct size spacer to allow for the motor. Very good. How about this. I know there are many ppl who make stocks for various guns and remember there is one guy who is making the G43 stock for around $125 or so. How about commissioning one of these stock makers to make some fully inleted stocks only about a 1/4" wider. They would look fantastic, but realistically speaking, when the new M1 Garand hits the market it will probably throw the skids to all of this home brew stuff. I forgot to say how I attached the brass part of the hinge to the AEG trigger assembly. I made the brass a tad too long and drilled and threaded a couple of holes to attach. No glue or epoxy now Last thing. I am unable to attend games. Health issues have seriously curtailed my activities. I love to build motors (antique) but am unable to do so anymore. My eyesite has also deterioated to the point that I am unable to make jewelry, but I can still see a big ole honking gun...so here i sit
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Post by jettalewis on Apr 2, 2012 13:12:08 GMT -5
2nd Bat. How would you determine that a particular stock came from the Greek army? I wouldn't mind getting one of those.
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