2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Sept 2, 2014 14:13:56 GMT -5
My son informed me that the release of a new WW2 Flick will be out soon. The title is FURY and it is set in Germany in the final push into the Rhineland. Bratt Pitt and an impressive cast star in it. The film was actually shot in the UK so they could take advantage of the availability of actual vehicles including the first film use of an actual TIGER I from the museum in Bovington. The trailer is available just google Bratt Pitt Fury.
The footage looks appropriately grimey and details look quite good. A successful WW2 flick will be good for all of us. This should be quite good and I am anxious to see it. Interestingly Clint Eastwood (of Hogan Heroes) son is in the flick.
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ScottCollins
Private 1st Class
A people that values its privileges above its principles soon loses both.
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Post by ScottCollins on Sept 2, 2014 14:55:58 GMT -5
I predict a rise in people posting "How do I make and Airsoft Tank?" But seriously, if it is good then we need to jump on the hype of that to draw people in.
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stuka
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Post by stuka on Sept 2, 2014 16:22:24 GMT -5
Don't forget about Saints and Soldiers:The Void
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Post by ssgjoe on Sept 5, 2014 17:37:05 GMT -5
I'm excited for the new SaS.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 1, 2014 0:10:16 GMT -5
Starting to see posters and trailers at the theaters for the release of FURY. I am predicting it will be well recieved and will do great things with regard to create excitement with all things WW2 and that includes our hobby.
I hope I am not disappointed but I a really looking forward to this movie!
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 11, 2014 23:19:29 GMT -5
Early reviews are in from critics (who seldom hold much weight for me). With few exceptions they are extremely positive which is quite unusual for war movies. Combat driven story lines seldom receive postive comments. It will apparently be formulaic and perhaps a bit trite with regard to character development but truthfully in the military it was quite common to find yourself amongst a group of widely diverse somewhat over the top personalities. Certainly that was my experience.
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Post by luftwelle93 on Oct 12, 2014 13:45:00 GMT -5
I want to see it with my college friends.Just need to convince them and get a ride :DAs much as WWII movies keeping coming up all the time,this one looks good at least.
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Post by huxy on Oct 14, 2014 15:48:09 GMT -5
I've actually been asked to attend an opening ceremony next friday (FURY premieres the 24th here). I, along with three others, will attend in uniform with a Tiger I replica. Built on a T55, it has been in Sweden for years. Now it's to be placed in a new museum in Norway after a short visit outside the main theatre in Norway. The tank has starred in many movies itself, most recently Dead Snow 2.
I'm so hyped.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 14, 2014 20:22:21 GMT -5
How cool is that! Be sure to post pictures from the premier.
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Post by insterburger on Oct 15, 2014 15:16:25 GMT -5
Awesome, Huxy! Have fun and represent!
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 16, 2014 0:14:40 GMT -5
So my wife also wants to see this (probably because of Brad Pitt) but also because she knows how much I am looking forward to it. We are going to go to the first showing (a matinee ) on Friday.
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Post by huxy on Oct 16, 2014 18:55:47 GMT -5
How cool is that! Be sure to post pictures from the premier. Will do!! And thanks, Insterburger! I'm so exited.
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Post by brownien on Oct 16, 2014 21:41:18 GMT -5
Just caught FURY tonight! I must say it's very authentic in uniforms, combat and feel. Very gory though, they really didn't sugar coat over anything. I think it's better that way, it tells the gritty truth.
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Post by luftwelle93 on Oct 16, 2014 22:27:43 GMT -5
I got to see it!
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 16, 2014 22:38:49 GMT -5
I have a date with my wife to see it tomorrow at 12:30.
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stuka
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Post by stuka on Oct 16, 2014 23:01:30 GMT -5
In one of the ads there appered to be some sort of love interest, was that a big factor?
edit, should pry just PM if people don't want to see spoilers
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Post by luftwelle93 on Oct 17, 2014 13:05:56 GMT -5
From what I heard its VERY realistic and gritty.
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Post by insterburger on Oct 17, 2014 16:21:21 GMT -5
If you're going to realistically portray armored combat in WWII, you're going to show some pretty unwatchable stuff (I recall one anecdote about someone watching a German tank burn, and seeing the heated body fat from one of the crewmen oozing out of the escape hatch under the hull). Good to hear they didn't pull punches. I'm looking forward to seeing it.
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Post by luftwelle93 on Oct 17, 2014 16:29:13 GMT -5
If you're going to realistically portray armored combat in WWII, you're going to show some pretty unwatchable stuff (I recall one anecdote about someone watching a German tank burn, and seeing the heated body fat from one of the crewmen oozing out of the escape hatch under the hull). Good to hear they didn't pull punches. I'm looking forward to seeing it. A disturbing sight that would have been :(Tank warfare is a bloody business and hopefully they show it in such light.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 17, 2014 18:14:06 GMT -5
i can not remember being so anxious to see a movie as this one. the subject matter of tank combat in WW2 has been frankly a life time obsession. Enroute to the film the thought crossed my mind that with all the personal hype and anticipation I had to steel myself for dissapointment. from the open sequence to the credits at the end I could not have been more pleased. This movie was EXTREMELY well done. The photography, locations, vehicles, uniforms and even to a large extent the tactics were spot on. The acting was far better then I expected and the dialogue and brutal nature of combat soldiers was true to life in every respect. The Action scenes were as intense as anything I have viewed in film and there is great insight into the brutality of combat and the complexities of the human condition.
A GREAT Film. It will not disappoint. As with any hollywood depiction there are things to quibble about but they are trivial when compared to all the things they got right.
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Post by luftwelle93 on Oct 17, 2014 18:57:46 GMT -5
Oh wow it sounds great!Wish I could see it tonight but tomorrow seams like a good day.From what it sounds it could just rival Saving Private Ryan.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 17, 2014 19:17:30 GMT -5
I think the combat scenes actually outdo Saving Private Ryan in terms of intensity and that is saying a lot. There were far too many subtle details that were well done to fully appreciate in one viewing. This is definitely a film I will see more then once and one I will see several times on the big screen.
The missions were credible, the encounters and reactions were correct and while the final battle is definitely Hollywood "Over the top" since I anticipated that I was okay with it. The grime, mud, tattered look of the equipment and vehicles and angles from the cameras really made one feel, see, hear and even smell the action. The inside of a combat tank is not a smell one forgets. This is my favorite War Movies of all time and now one of my favorite films.
I can't endorse it enough. I want a platoon of m4 tanks!
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Post by luftwelle93 on Oct 18, 2014 10:46:13 GMT -5
I'll probably catch it either this evening or tomorrow.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 18, 2014 12:58:53 GMT -5
Good luck with it as I tried to go again and all showings this weekend are already sold out. Seattle is a big film market so the same may not be the case where you live. This of course will settle down with time. The audience is mostly male (as you might expect) so I suspect the big turnout will be short lived and not sustainable. As mentioned earlier this film makes me want to build replica tanks for airsoft.
Armored warfare while a critical part of WW2 was actually a very small piece relative to Infantry and Artillery engagements in Western Europe. Tankers saw far more combat than most fighting elements as they were like fireman constantly being moved to the points of actual or anticipated conflict. As depicted in the movie most of the encounters with the enemy were german infantry armed with panzerfausts or wheeled AT guns like the PAK 40s. tank vs tank encounters were actually fairly rare and Sherman vs TIGER encounters rarer still. (thankfully).
The depicted skirmish with the TIGER played out very authentically. The Sherman column (a realistic mix of M4 variants) was engaged on a road with no opportunity to withdraw so turning and attacking really was their only option. Normally four Shermans engaged by a TIGER would have ditti bopped to the closest position of cover and retreated. The quick firing of WP smoke by the M4s caused the TIGER to leave its stationary and protected position and attack as well. All quite credible. As depicted in the movie the platoon realized that four on one was probably a death sentence for them but again they really had no option. The TIGER by the way is one of the few actually fully functional TIGER Is and the first time a REAL tiger has appeared in a film. The movie was filmed in England so they could take advantage of the Bovington Museums wonderful collection.
it resulted in one of my all time favorite battle scenes although in this movie there are many. The tank Infantry attack, the combat in the cities and the way they lit up the mill with White Pospherous all very very cool.
By April of 45 even the vaunted SS units were filled with conscripts and poorly trained combatants often times the young kids were the most fanatic and dangerous.
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Post by volkssturm on Oct 18, 2014 17:00:32 GMT -5
I'm curious. Does the expression "light'em up" actually date to WWII? Referring to shooting at the enemy, not lighting up cigarettes?
Regarding WP, besides blinding the enemy tank, there were instances where firing WP at a German tank would cause the crew to panic and bail out thinking the tank was on fire.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 18, 2014 17:48:06 GMT -5
"Willy Pete" is one of those cinemagraphic effects that hollywood directors love because its visually so dramatic when in reality as you know Volkstrum its primary role was as a marking round to help adjust artillery. In the case of tanks it found itself primarily used to blind the enemy. Having said that white phosphorous was extremely incendiary and had the potential to cause fires or damage by working its way through the engine vents.
Also with fuel (and especially munitions powder) the inside of a tank is not the place you want to be if an internal fire starts. The time to safely get out is measured in seconds so crews very emphatically bailed out of tanks both German and especially Allied and particularly so by this late date in the war when seasoned crews knew from first hand experience just how horrible such an end would be.
In the confusion of combat its hard to tell what the source of smoke is and it would take an extremely disciplined crew to stay onboard. TIGERs were rare and were generally manned by very seasoned and gifted crews. Typically when knocked out a US tank crew on average lost 1 1/2 crew members although in catastophic hits all five might be killed. The late war Sherman added a hatch for the loader to escape through as they suffered the most casualties.
In the film both 75mm M4s and 76mm Shermans were used and these would typically be mixed in the same platoons. The short barrel 75mm actually had a better anti Infantry capability as its HE round was more effective than the 76mm which had somewhat improved anti armor ballistic properties. Fury was a late war " Easy Eight" 76mm with the muzzle brake. The suspension and flotation capabilities with its wider tread was its primary improvement although with wet storage for its ammunition it also was somewhat less vulnerable to enemy fire. Shermans were nicknamed RONSONs after the cigarette lighter which was famous for lighting right up each and everytime.
In reality Fury took more hits and survived far more then would have been likely. Having said that, in war anything with even the tiniest shread of probability no doubt happened. powerful powerful movie.
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Post by kilroysbrother on Oct 20, 2014 19:38:19 GMT -5
Got to see Fury the other day. I have got to say I like Fury better than Saving Private Ryan! Fury was an awesome movie that really accurately portrayed war. This movie will actually give you a feel for how war actually is and has a more realistic storyline than SPR. I honestly recommend everyone to see this movie because it shows the horrors of war and might change peoples mind when it comes wanting war.
P.S. I love how they followed a replacement.
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Post by volkssturm on Oct 20, 2014 21:28:14 GMT -5
Going to try to see it this week. I thought SPR was done very well, but the basic premise was flawed as far as plausibility.
I just happened to think, if they were inclined to make a sequel to "Fury" they could do a prequel with the tank crew in North Africa. The North African campaign has a lot of interesting aspects to it (Rick Atkinson's "An Army at Dawn" is very good for background) and it's never gotten that much coverage.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 21, 2014 12:28:24 GMT -5
the" innocent" time for the American Army. they were naive and clueless. Soldiers and especially leaders made many mistakes which were easily exploited by the Germans. The propaganda of the time suggested that US tanks, armored cars and anti tank weapons were superior and soldiers still wantd to believe it. The North African campaign always seemed completely un neccessary to me as a distraction from the main task at hand but politically it was essential to show Russia the west was willing to fight somewhere.
In reality it was a training labratory for American Leaders and a means by which the UK and US learned how to work together. It would be tough to gather or create many of the early war vehicles and get them sufficiently functional. Would War Daddy have started out in an M3 Grant? Perhaps a stamped hull M4. he might have started in a Stuart Light tank as two of the three Armored Companies in a Battalion at that time were light tanks. By Normandy this was reversed. He certainly wouldn't have been in "FURY" as she was a very late war M4 EA8 "Easy 8"
North Africa and the Normandy Hedgerow fighting, Counter Attack at Mortain, Arracourt (which was the largest actual head to head tank battle for the US and Germany) The Ardennes, would make great prequels. No doubt if the film is enormously successful financially the demand for a follow upwill be too great ror Hollywood to resist. Lets hope so as I want to see more of these!
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Post by volkssturm on Oct 21, 2014 16:05:04 GMT -5
IMHO the North African campaign was absolutely necessary. Part of it is the strategic importance, freeing up the Mediterranean. But most importantly, as you say, as a laboratory. When you look at the state of American military thinking in 1940-41 you almost have to wonder what world they were living in. Even with the combat experience gained in NA the people writing the manuals still were wedded to ideas that were totally wrong. For example, at one point they decided to reduce the number of self-propelled AT guns and increase the towed AT guns, which later experience showed was completely bassackward. And then you have the experience of amphibious landings gained in North Africa, Sicily and Italy. D-Day worked as well as it did because there was a body of planners and leaders who'd done 1, 2, or 3 landings already. It boggles the mind that there were American generals who seriously talked about invading France in 1942. Sorry to ramble on off topic. But I'm having fun so the heck with it.
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