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Post by aj czarkowski on Apr 12, 2015 12:37:19 GMT -5
The old 8mm Marushin M1 Carbine and M2 Carbine's all had the same issues with their pot metal bolts. Such superior technology. So I know that people have gotten a hold of these replacement bolts before, but I have no clue where or how they obtain them. I remember in another thread on the subject a few years ago someone referred me to an online store, but I'm unable to find the thread now. So does anyone know where you can buy these? And is there anyone who has actually bought one themselves? I know it's probably more practical to just use a different airsoft gun, but I've sold all of mine but this M1 Carbine and a couple bolt actions that I built. I'd rather just have it repaired then have to buy a new airsoft gun. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!
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shiftysgarand
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Post by shiftysgarand on Apr 12, 2015 13:08:49 GMT -5
The online store referenced has sold out of them. I would suggest you go to your local machine shop and ask them to use it as filler work to keep the price down. I'm having a Garand bolt made in this fashion.
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Post by aj czarkowski on Apr 12, 2015 13:13:47 GMT -5
Ah, that was you who mentioned that website. I'll give that a shot, and try to find a machine shop. What do you mean by filler work though? I thought that was something for wood. Also, did you have the bolt in tact when you gave it to them for reference? Thanks.
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shiftysgarand
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Post by shiftysgarand on Apr 12, 2015 14:15:52 GMT -5
I gave thm a broken bolt which they then JB welded back together. What I mean by 'filler work' is that they have a machinist work on it when they have nothing else to do. It takes longer than if it were a regular project, but it's much cheaper.
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Post by aj czarkowski on Apr 12, 2015 14:29:28 GMT -5
Ahh crap, mine broke in the middle of a game, and I couldn't find the bolt. Maybe if I disassembled the gun and brought the receiver to them they could come up with a part that would fit. I imagine that would take some trial and error though. I know you mentioned you owned Marushin's M1 Garand, but you wouldn't happen to own, or know someone who owns, their Carbine? Perhaps they wouldn't mind taking measurements.
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Post by insterburger on Apr 12, 2015 14:46:05 GMT -5
Is there a piece of the part still with the gun? That might help. If you have a piece of it and can show them a pic of what the rest should look like they may be able to fabricate it. It will probably add to the cost though.
Still, in the end you will have a fabulous, indestructible part.
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Post by aj czarkowski on Apr 12, 2015 14:56:32 GMT -5
I believe I do still have a piece of the bolt somewhere, and good call on getting pictures. It probably will add to the cost like you said, but hopefully will still be cheaper than having to buy a new high end airsoft gun. Thanks!
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Apr 12, 2015 19:45:40 GMT -5
The cost of a fabricated part at a machine shop will probably exceed the cost of areplacement gun. If you find a shop intrigued with the project they might cut you a break if they can approach it as a side job like shifty said. To that point, it seems like it has been over a year since you mentioned getting that done shifty! for goodness sakes how is that going? My concern with a true steel part is that it will end up weighing too much unless the part is made in aluminum and now you are really talking big dough.
GBB rifles continue to be more hassle than they are worth. Everyone i hve ever bought ate their young and ended up being sold as static props. Two marushin Garands, a hudson grease gun and three Marushin carbines. (i am a slow learner!). I had high hopes for the latest CO2 carbine but alas it too broke at the charging handle having never been used in a skirmish. I did get over 1000 rounds through it which was a record for me with a gbb gun.
Good luck in your efforts to get the gun working again and that extends to the dozen upon dozens of folks in the same boat.
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shiftysgarand
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Post by shiftysgarand on Apr 12, 2015 20:21:48 GMT -5
Thank you, 2nd Bat. The whole Garand story seems to be never-ending. The guy who was supposed to make me a steel part 45 ended up being a scam artist (after about a year, I discovered other people having issues with him), and now I'm having a shop within walking distance of my house do it as a side job. I have another bolt taken from another broken Garand in mine so it functions, but this whole adventure is far from over.
If (and as you have said this is a mighty big if) RA-Tech were to make steel or other upgrade parts for Marushin's blowback rifle line, antonius augustus, myself, and hundreds of others wouldn't be in this mess.
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Post by hardslack on Apr 12, 2015 21:32:58 GMT -5
How complex are the bolts? I ask because in addition to my BA i'm doing a machining certificate at a local community college, and I need stuff to do. It's a new program and poorly organized, so learning new skills is practically 95% my responsibility. As such im looking for projects to do. Stuff like this would be great, but there's no telling how long it would take at the rate we are being taught...
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Apr 12, 2015 23:04:30 GMT -5
Hardstack this would be a fabulous project as a learning opportunity. Please link up with the necessary folks to make it happen. Hopefully someone can provide you with the broken components. (in their entrety) so you can see precisely what needs to be created. There are literally hundreds upon hundreds of folks with non funtioning rifles who are currently unable to get a suitable replacement part.
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Post by shiftysgarand on Apr 13, 2015 16:29:25 GMT -5
How complex are the bolts? I ask because in addition to my BA i'm doing a machining certificate at a local community college, and I need stuff to do. It's a new program and poorly organized, so learning new skills is practically 95% my responsibility. As such im looking for projects to do. Stuff like this would be great, but there's no telling how long it would take at the rate we are being taught... The Garand bolt is extremely complicated and difficult to machine, but the Carbine's looks simple enough (basically a cylinder). If you decided to sell these for profit, however, you would find yourself struggling to keep up with the orders. Almost everyone in the world with a Marushin rifle has a broken Marushin rifle and this would be a great boost to the hobby as a whole.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Apr 13, 2015 16:34:51 GMT -5
With the Marushin and HUDSON Gas blow backs, its not IF the gun is going to fail but how QUICKLY. I have AEGs that I have owned and used since 1993 that still work fine and never had a GBB rifle last four months.
Creating and making available such parts would be an enormously beneficial project for our community.
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Post by insterburger on Apr 13, 2015 17:10:12 GMT -5
I think once someone had the tooling and steps worked out to make these, the economy of scale of providing replacement parts could allow them to be offered at non-crazy prices-- provided the customers and supplier could connect.
I'm betting most of the broken rifles are still around. I'm always reluctant to throw out "hopelessly" broken things, especially if they make a good display piece... I still have the slide (albeit stripped of all usable parts) from a P38 where the front band broke and the rails started separating (thank God I noticed before catastrophic failure). The rifles are out there, it's just letting the owners know there's hope for their babies.
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Post by aj czarkowski on Apr 13, 2015 23:38:48 GMT -5
It seems unfortunately I don't have any part of the broken bolt whatsoever. I agree that there would be a huge market for the infamous part 45. I also agree that gas airsoft rifles are a pain in the a$$! But being the first airsoft gun I owned, and having sold all my other ones at this point, makes me want this thing fixed even more. I bought it when I was 12, it broke when I was 14, and now I'm 18 lol. Should anyone actually get started making the steel bolt for the Marushin M1 Carbine, let me know, I'll be one of the first in line to buy one. Just make sure it's the 8mm one! I will get around to, in the next week or so, contacting a nearby machine shop. I'll let you guys know how it goes.
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Post by hardslack on Apr 14, 2015 0:53:45 GMT -5
I found a thread with the guy who shafted you Shifty. From the pictures I can see that part 45 is complex. Maybe someday I could do one, but it would take having a complete or nearly bolt and a rifle to fit it to, or lot of back and forth with the rifle ownert. If one had a CAD drawing of #45, a CNC could probably crank a lot of blanks out and then fiddly bits could be hand filed to fit. Actual material (aluminum) could be 15$ per part, and if the CAD file was already done, in this dream world, a CNC school would be excited to help out, and one could even see about scrap aluminum from other shops to make the bolts. I really have no idea on its size, but i'm surprised at what some places count as scrap.
Antonius, you might look around and see if their is a technical school or community college near you with a CNC machining program. If so, you could possibly get a part made for a lot less, I know the two schools I am familiar with have students nearing graduation who are competent and could tackle a project like this. The cost would be a lot less than a traditional shop. Most of the money you spend is for a guy to figure out how to make the part, and most of that is figuring how to hold it with clamps and fixtures, so at a school the student has paid for the time in a way... anyway, its something to consider. Also, look around and see if their is a "makerspace" or Hackerspace" nearby with machining going on. Some are pretty youth educational focused, like for elementary school "STEM" stuff, but some are like, legit shops that members pay dues and get access to a huge variety of tools. A cousin of mine was in a great one around Los Angeles with any kind of tool you could want. You might get lucky and connect with some real DIY masters who could make a bolt for you. Another option you could check, depends on where you live.
In general as far as schools go, it depends, some have real strict crotchety instructors who wont want any outsider projects, and some have real open minded people who love creating and would be thrilled about this.
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Post by aj czarkowski on Apr 14, 2015 12:48:04 GMT -5
Thanks for the advice, but unfortunately I'd imagine I'll run into trouble trying to get technical school students to fabricate a part to an airsoft gun. I live in Connecticut, and as you can imagine in the past couple years things have gotten pretty strict here as far as any guns go, whether real steel, airsoft, paintball, or replicas. It might pay off to see if something can be done, but I'm a bit afraid to. I'll probably go with the machine shop route though
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Post by fishmeok on Jul 8, 2015 23:14:52 GMT -5
These guys have the Garand steel parts, I ordered an operating slide and cocking lever from them. Contact mikechchou@gmail.com from KIC. www.kic.com.tw/shop/advanced_search_result.php?XTCsid=6dce7ae8d97f05f7f392867fe2e51e5c&keywords=garand&x=0&y=0So mine now has a steel bolt (home made, came with the gun) steel operating slide, and steel cocking lever (44 and 42). I am in the process of fixing lots of little issues but at least it will not break the main parts now. Unfortunately they are out of the M2 carbine bolts so I still have a big issue with the carbine- Cheers Mark
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Post by aj czarkowski on Jul 16, 2015 11:08:04 GMT -5
Oh well, at least the guys who have the Garand can have theirs fixed.
Do you know if they plan on restocking the Carbine bolts or not? I am still interested after all these long months haha.
Thanks, AJ
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shiftysgarand
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Post by shiftysgarand on Jul 16, 2015 11:35:53 GMT -5
Was it the inner or outer bolt on your Carbine that broke? From pictures online, the outer bolt appears to be pretty much just a tube. Getting one made in a machine shop from steel shouldn't be too hard.
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Post by aj czarkowski on Jul 16, 2015 11:40:19 GMT -5
It was the outer one. The problem with the machine shop is I don't have a piece for them to copy. Like I said a few months ago, I assumed that would be the problem.
Hopefully that website may have them restocked at some point.
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Post by fishmeok on Jul 20, 2015 19:34:05 GMT -5
I think this is a better place to start: www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=494115042Its an unmachined M1 carbine (round) bolt casting. I have one on order to see how difficult it would be to use as a base to make a new one (I have an M2 carbine with a broken bolt too.) I don't think the bolt would be heat treated until after final machining so it should be soft enough to drill out and grind down. Cheers
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Post by aj czarkowski on Jul 28, 2015 10:50:56 GMT -5
Interesting. Let us know how it turns out, I may have to order one myself
AJ
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Post by fishmeok on Jul 31, 2015 17:36:17 GMT -5
Too small- worth a try though. I think we are all going to be stuck until they start making steel bolts for the new King Arms M1 Carbine that is coming out this Fall. I hear it is a Marushin clone.
Cheers
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Post by aj czarkowski on Aug 1, 2015 11:30:38 GMT -5
Ah well, worth a try. I didn't know they are going to make the bolts for the King Arms version out of steel, that's good news. Great if it's a Marushin clone
Cheers
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shiftysgarand
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Post by shiftysgarand on Aug 1, 2015 11:44:25 GMT -5
It is indeed a Marushin clone, but fishmeok where did you hear that they're making steel bolts for it? If true, I'm thrilled, but otherwise we may all have to badger RA Tech into making a line of Marushin parts.
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Post by fishmeok on Aug 4, 2015 19:00:00 GMT -5
Hello
I just assumed that RA would start making them again after the KA version comes out. Probably wishful thinking. I'm still trying to figure out what to do with mine. Maybe start with a piece of steel tubing, weld on some beads where the features go and complete by grinding down the material. Weld on a cap on the back and put spacers on the inside to get the proper depth.
I have tried repairing with a .020 thick piece of steel on the top of the bolt epoxied to hold the front and back halves of the broken bolt together, but nothing sticks to pot metal.
Cheers
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Post by fishmeok on Aug 10, 2015 20:05:39 GMT -5
I think the only way to go on this is 3D printing. Shapeways has stainless steel options. I don't know if the wall thickness would be too thin, but it's worth looking into. Someday when I have time I am going to learn how to 3D model. When I have time...
Cheers
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Post by shiftysgarand on Aug 10, 2015 20:22:34 GMT -5
I bet the wall thickness would be ok (especially if it's stainless steel), but due to the way that 3d printing works with layering and all, you might have some grooves that may affect tolerances. And if you're making only one, expect it to cost an arm, a leg, and your first born kid as well.
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Post by fishmeok on Aug 11, 2015 22:41:21 GMT -5
Yeah, I'm all over the place on this. I really like the M2 I have (and the extra mags) but on the other hand the new King Arms is only going to be $360 or so and I am sure the price will go down fairly quickly (sales, coupons, etc). I've read a few posts where it is claimed the KA version will be stronger, but I don't know that I believe that.
There is a CO2 M1 carbine on e-bay right now with a broken trigger. No takers at $270. Maybe it's time to sell the M2 for what I can get and see how the KA version holds up after it's released.
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