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Post by Jager.Drü on Feb 4, 2007 10:48:45 GMT -5
I don't see the point of paying $200+ for a pair of boots, for airsofting. Why, because you didn't go buy the Richard Underwood Dot44, you bought the asian stuff. Can you justify spending that much when you don't have a gun?
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Russianboy
Private 1st Class
Oberscharf?hrer
Posts: 502
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Post by Russianboy on Feb 4, 2007 10:54:40 GMT -5
The asian stuff is starting to look real good, give them maybe 2-3 more years.
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Post by Jager.Drü on Feb 4, 2007 10:59:20 GMT -5
Yes I'll agree with you on that, but he did everything sub-standard and why spend all that money on boots? german gun > hobnailed jackboots.
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Post by CharleyNovember on Feb 4, 2007 14:20:53 GMT -5
I would give them less than 2-3 years. They seem to adapt to the marketplace pretty quickly.
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Post by mikkel on Feb 4, 2007 19:25:31 GMT -5
Yes, and the majority of their stuff is still lightyears from being acceptable  It's funny to see how the prices on the asian stuff have increased, when the stuff gets better. Wonder what will happen in the future... Bakc to topic: If you got the cheap uniform solution (and i think it's perfectly ok for airsoft), ten i can't see the idea of spending more than the rest of the uniform, on a pair of boots. Nothing wrong with rubber soled WG or EG boots. It's not perfect, but not a catastrophy either. On the other hand, a pair of not too modern looking combat boots, and gaither over, actually look quite ok too, and saves you the trouble of having boots for both regular and ww2 airsoft. Plus lowboots are the best option for late war. |
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Post by CharleyNovember on Feb 4, 2007 19:29:24 GMT -5
You do notice a corrolation between the quality of the HK stuff and the prices starting to creep up. However look at the MP40 they took a total wreck reverse engineered it and gave us a decent working MP40 that actually works for less than half the price?
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Russianboy
Private 1st Class
Oberscharf?hrer
Posts: 502
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Post by Russianboy on Feb 4, 2007 19:36:55 GMT -5
You guys do know that all the German unifroms at "At the front" are made in Hong Kong, right?
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Nimlas
Master sergeant 
grumpy
Posts: 1,594
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Post by Nimlas on Feb 4, 2007 19:47:11 GMT -5
You guys do know that all the German unifroms at "At the front" are made in Hong Kong, right? Rollin still makes his own SS camo and other things. Occasionally HKK gets overruns, but that supposedly doesn't happen anymore. it is made in HK , but Rollin raises hell until they get it right. Try comparing a Sturm jumpsuit and an ATF import. same company, totally different suit. |
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Post by Capt. Zak on Feb 5, 2007 13:11:01 GMT -5
You guys do know that all the German unifroms at "At the front" are made in Hong Kong, right? Rollin still makes his own SS camo and other things. Occasionally HKK gets overruns, but that supposedly doesn't happen anymore. it is made in HK , but Rollin raises hell until they get it right. Try comparing a Sturm jumpsuit and an ATF import. same company, totally different suit. More of his stuff comes from HK than you think. He may raise hell, but HK is improving these uniforms not because Rollin want's them improved...but because they will sell more. The one exception is the HK fliegerbluse (Barry & Keith), they still haven't gotten that right.  That's why I sell the Sturm Fliegerbluse. Same one ATF sells and mine is $10.00 cheaper. ;D |
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29ththerealpimps
Private 1st Class
3rd Armored Division 32nd Armored Regiment 83rd Recon Battalion
Posts: 706
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Post by 29ththerealpimps on Feb 5, 2007 13:25:30 GMT -5
I have been to the atthefront warehouse in columbia, KY, and there tunics looked exactly like capt. zaks at the october 7th battle. Also jacob, I would get the lowboots and gaitors(That is until you buy that wool tunic and wool pants from me, then you should get jackboots).if some of yall arent worried about money I would check this guy out His stuff is the best of the best(But expensive) www.1944militaria.com |
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Post by mikkel on Feb 5, 2007 14:23:44 GMT -5
The german uniforms ATF sell is Sturm, they are made in mainland China. They are not the result of some chinese company, but the result of a german company that gives the exact directions to the chinese subcontractor. Personally I don't use Sturm, it's not enough for me. I go with made-to-measure uniform from Richard A Underwood. This isn't even the best of the best, to get that, you would have to get it from Janke of Germany, it's a familiy owned tailor firm that also made uniform durings the war. They will give you the second best next to an original! My point was that, that the chinese uniforms are not up to high grade standards. They are ok for airsofting, especially if prople don't want to shell out 1000-1500$ for the correct kit. But to say they are perfect is not quite the truth  And somehow the price is going up, each time the quality improves. |
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Post by baconandeggs on Feb 6, 2007 15:48:45 GMT -5
Although I've always received good service from Bill Bureau, consider buying a uniform other than a Janke, they are very expensive and are not worth the extra money. While undoubtedly made out of the best wool of any repro being made today, that does not make up for poor tailoring; wrong chest pockets and a lack of chest darts are just two of the problems. In a cheap uniform, that is forgivable. Not at Janke's price, however.
Lostbattalions.com has better repro uniforms, probably the best available stateside, imho.
Hessenantique sells the Sturm product, which is OK but like Janke has some tailoring issues (skirt way too long, not angled from front to back, straight sleeves, etc.). None the less, Sturm is nice, for the price. AtTheFront used to sell Sturm uniforms, however I understand they now source their own straight from the far east (where Sturm ones are now made, also).
Mr. Curtis (at A.T.F.) will be only to happy to elucidate why that's not a handicap.
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Post by mikkel on Feb 6, 2007 18:57:33 GMT -5
Thats odd, the Janke uniforms we have in our reenactment unit are completely impossible to tell apart from the originals some members own (apart from the ageing of course  ) The way their uniforms are made, is the exact same way they made uniform to the german wehrmacht some 70 years ago. But maybe they also complained Lost battalions use wrong wool. For late war uiforms they are ok, but not their higher quality early war stuff. |
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Post by baconandeggs on Feb 7, 2007 15:16:17 GMT -5
Understand that my opinions (and information) may be a bit dated, as I have been out of reenacting for several years now. Things change.
That is one reason many of us old guys are excited about all the new, more affordable offerings from the far east. Until a couple of years ago, there really was not more than a few places to purchase from. Hopefully, it will get more people into what is, unfortunately, something of a stagnated hobby (where new people coming in roughly equal those leaving).
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Post by 5thrangerinfantry on Feb 15, 2007 7:57:04 GMT -5
I've heard complaints about both underwood and janke.....so the only thing close to an original is...another original.
Back to the main topic of boots. Buy the best boots you can. Some say that the boots dont have to be perfect or could be a lower standard but I disagree.
1) You can always tell a guy who did it on the cheap by his boots. I've seen lots of guys that have made alterations to cheap uniforms to make them look superb, but the boots always give them away.
2) As you may upgrade your uniform eventually, good boots will be one less thing to upgrade.
3) Always take care of your feet. An Army survives on its stomach and moves on its feet - take care of your feet and they will take care of you.
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Post by Capt. Zak on Feb 15, 2007 9:20:59 GMT -5
Just get yourself a good pair of CORRECT boots. I agree that a guy with a great impression loses points when you see his Walmart boots. Low boots are a bit less that jack boots, so concider that as well.
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Post by mikkel on Feb 15, 2007 9:44:18 GMT -5
5thrangerinfantry> Yes, but as originals are a ad thing to take to the field, we use the second best And there are a huge diffrence between a button falling off, than the entire garment is cut wrong and fits like a sack of potatoes As said before, and now proven on photos in the other tread. Modern boots with gaiters can look quite ok. |
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Post by twotypes on Feb 15, 2007 11:58:33 GMT -5
As said before, and now proven on photos in the other tread. Modern boots with gaiters can look quite ok. Wow, no offense, but that is SO vague. I'm not a stitch nazi by any means, but if one is going to use a pair of modern boots to simulate the low boot/anklet combo, at least try to get a pair that is as close to the look of the original as possible. In other words, a pair of clunky gortex/thinsulate lined hunting boots with massive rubber lug soles are NOT going to get the job done. Do some photographic research and find the best "close enough" you can afford. As for jack boots, that's another matter entirely. I guess East German jacks would be okay if that's all you can afford and they've got your size, but ATF's repro is not really that expensive considering what you get for the money. $150 bucks for a full on copy complete with hob nails is NOT that bad, even compared to modern street shoe prices. Cheers! |
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Post by 5thrangerinfantry on Feb 15, 2007 12:46:24 GMT -5
5thrangerinfantry> Yes, but as originals are a ad thing to take to the field, we use the second best And there are a huge diffrence between a button falling off, than the entire garment is cut wrong and fits like a sack of potatoes As said before, and now proven on photos in the other tread. Modern boots with gaiters can look quite ok. The complaints I have heard about underwood and janke are about the quality of the wool, actually - the courseness and the feel and such. And in the other threads, I noticed the footwear right off....I'm not a boot expert, but it sticks out lick a sore thumb. |
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Post by Ripper on Feb 15, 2007 13:32:02 GMT -5
Anybody seen these? www.sportsmansguide.com/cb/cb.asp?a=328438They have the rounded toe and smooth sides similar to the real short boots. I play in an area that is all steep hills and wooded, so I'm looking for some ankle support. The gaitors will cover the top half quite handily. BUT, I don't want to buy them if they are gonna stand out like a sore thumb. |
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Post by twotypes on Feb 15, 2007 14:30:07 GMT -5
Anybody seen these? www.sportsmansguide.com/cb/cb.asp?a=328438They have the rounded toe and smooth sides similar to the real short boots. I play in an area that is all steep hills and wooded, so I'm looking for some ankle support. The gaitors will cover the top half quite handily. BUT, I don't want to buy them if they are gonna stand out like a sore thumb. I think those would stick out too much. Firstly, the toe is the wrong shape. German lowboots had a distinctly lower profile, more of a pointed look which ATF refers to as "shark nosed." Secondly, the color may attract too much attention if you're doing late war because it's my understanding that orders went out in 1943 forbidding the blackening of low boots. With this in mind you'd be better off with something brown, or even better, natural colored roughout leather that had been given a good coat of Sno Seal. You might be able to hide the padded ankle sections under anklets, but remember this: anklets are notorious for NOT STAYING PUT. As soon as soon you start moving around they're going to start shifting and your "clever subterfuge will be revealed for the parsimony (look it up) for which it is." ;D Cheers! |
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Post by Ripper on Feb 15, 2007 14:35:14 GMT -5
Cool. I have a set of East german jackboots for early war stuff, but my primary focus is late war. I'll go with something in a brown.
Thanks much.
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Post by Capt. Zak on Feb 15, 2007 17:38:21 GMT -5
Secondly, the color may attract too much attention if you're doing late war because it's my understanding that orders went out in 1943 forbidding the blackening of low boots. Black or brown is fine throughout the war. There were all sorts of "orders" given, remove helmet decals, remove cuff titles, etc. Lil' Adolf just liked hearing himself talk. But a Soldier would blacken his boots usually with axle grease in order to waterproof them. Guys in the field improvise, so you can be accurate with black low boots, a single decal helmet and a cuff title. Even if you are doing very late war. |
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Post by Capt. Zak on Feb 15, 2007 17:44:28 GMT -5
A great alternative to $200.00 jack & low boots is to buy a pair of US rough out service shoes. Repros (which I can order) are only $100.00. You can darken them up and they look great. They do not have hobnails but they look WAY better than Walmart boots or the stuff Sportsmans Guide has. Some guys do not like hobnails, so for some, US rough outs are a perfect alternative.
I have sold US rough outs to more German reenactors than US reenactors. LOL
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Post by CharleyNovember on Feb 15, 2007 18:08:57 GMT -5
I'm saving up for roughouts now. I'll let ya know Zak |
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Post by twotypes on Feb 15, 2007 19:27:16 GMT -5
A great alternative to $200.00 jack & low boots is to buy a pair of US rough out service shoes. Repros (which I can order) are only $100.00. You can darken them up and they look great. They do not have hobnails but they look WAY better than Walmart boots or the stuff Sportsmans Guide has. Some guys do not like hobnails, so for some, US rough outs are a perfect alternative. I have sold US rough outs to more German reenactors than US reenactors. LOL Perfect solution, Zak. And the composition sole is much better than plain leather. I've had a pair from another vendor for five years, and they still look great. Cheers! |
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Post by 5thrangerinfantry on Feb 16, 2007 8:34:16 GMT -5
Roughouts?!! LOL thats a great idea! I never would have thought of that one....
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Post by lordashtaroth on Feb 16, 2007 12:17:29 GMT -5
Damnit, he's right. Blast you and your excellent selling point!
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Post by Capt. Zak on Feb 16, 2007 19:50:50 GMT -5
;D
What I will do is start a post here with everyone interested in the repro rough out boots. Then, I will make a bulk order. This will allow me to order more of a volume at once and get a better price. It may take a few days longer to get them in your hands but they will be cheaper. It's a trade off.
What are everyones thoughts on that? Assuming you guys are going to buy them from me. I have thought of doing this from time to time with uniforms as well. Allowing me to buy in larger quantities and getting better deals.
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Post by mikkel on Feb 16, 2007 23:41:31 GMT -5
The complaints I have heard about underwood and janke are about the quality of the wool, actually - the courseness and the feel and such. The people saying that don't have a clue what they are talking about. Underwood gets his wool from a european woolmill that made the stuff before and ruring the war, for the german army. Janke got their very own patented wool blend, it hasen't changed since before the war. Go and compare to original examples, it's spot on. (mainly pre- and early war, later during the war there was dozens of different types). But maybe the original stuff isn't up to some peoples imagination |
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That's why I sell the Sturm Fliegerbluse. Same one ATF sells and mine is $10.00 cheaper. ;D
And somehow the price is going up, each time the quality improves.
)
