CptJericho
Private 1st Class
"We got to stop the Germans from getting the secret weapons!"
Posts: 495
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Post by CptJericho on Oct 12, 2009 20:19:25 GMT -5
Ok I was searching the threads when I came across what 2nd Bat said. Quote: That has been my hope since I started this project. I know some Chinese companies are well aware of my efforts and at least one for sure felt that 300 plus sales of any one rifle are just not enough to justify the tooling. I tried to explain that sales at 500.00 plus are significantly different than sales at under 200.00 but their response was tooling is huge money and they just didn't feel the market would support volume of a long low capacity, semi only rifle regardless of the the price point. WW2 enthusiasts simply don't rerpresent a large enough market segment. So I started thinking, why dont I create a poll and see how many people would jump on the idea of a cheap $250 garand. This is to try to justify that it is a big enough market that they will make money and it will not be a waste of time, hopefully this will get lots of votes to show there is big demand for the Garand.
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Post by airbornerocks on Oct 12, 2009 20:23:30 GMT -5
Maybe it would depend on how good it is manufactured, I am not going to waste $250 on a crappy Garand but I would on a good one. It would really have to go down on the reviews of the gun before i did, but yes i would
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Sgt_Tom
Technical Sgt.
Combat!
Posts: 3,580
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Oct 12, 2009 20:25:14 GMT -5
If it was as good as an AGM M14 I would definitely buy it. That price is about $20 more then I spent on my conversion. But adding the labor and the trouble finding mags its a bargain!!!
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godo
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Are you careful what you say or write?
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Post by godo on Oct 12, 2009 20:39:35 GMT -5
I would. I have my launcher all set up and ready.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 13, 2009 2:15:37 GMT -5
Absolutely. Such a model if decently done would be a event changer for this hobby in my opinion. If it provided performance equal to the current Chinese long rifle AEGs it would be hot. I'd buy several without any hesitation at all.
Loaner guns and rental guns for local events to help promote the sport.
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WhiteRook
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Unofficial Awesome
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Post by WhiteRook on Oct 13, 2009 6:19:54 GMT -5
Yes. Even if it was somewhat low quality I'd get it and redo the internals.
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Post by CharleyNovember on Oct 13, 2009 8:05:11 GMT -5
I think I see their point 8 yes 1 no and few maybes...I wouldn't throw money into tooling up for that when I can rake in cash making more knock off AK's and M4's. I am very very pleased they made a STEN and the MP44.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 13, 2009 13:30:25 GMT -5
I know the potential market for a quality affordable Garand AEG is huge and hope this microcosmic poll doesn't reflect otherwise. However many Marushin Garands got sold you know an AEG in the 250 range or below would do 20 times as well since it would not be burdened with the reputation issues the GBB Garand has related to reliability and durability.
If a Garand doesn't get made what chance does a carbine, grease gun, affordable BAR, Ivar Johnson etc. have? I think the relatively poor sales performance of the gas offerings and shell ejecting jokes has clouded the manufacturers appreciation for the potetntial of this market. I think the MP40, Sten and MP 44 have done quite well which should bode well for other WW2 AEG weapons. Hopefully anyway.
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Post by CharleyNovember on Oct 13, 2009 14:43:20 GMT -5
Again I am still surprised and tickled pink that the STEN was made. I have a Garand. You offer a very good IMHO Garand. I think they are more likely to produce more WW2 automatics then a Garand as the appeal for a BAR or a grease gun would be more universal. It's kind of sad because like you I would like to see both an affordable Garand and a carbine.
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Post by airbornerocks on Oct 13, 2009 15:18:45 GMT -5
2nd Bat, I say we come to your house and build a factory where all of us WW2AA members help you make garands
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Post by sarge12 on Oct 13, 2009 16:40:24 GMT -5
Man I've always wanted to buy an aeg garand, but $400 will burn a hole in my savings
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Post by mischief on Oct 13, 2009 17:32:13 GMT -5
I don't ever plan on putting a US impression together, but a cheap Garand would be too nice to pass up.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 13, 2009 23:41:22 GMT -5
I wonder how many Gas Marushin Garands sold? That would probably provide a reasonably accurate estimate on the potential market. Obviously a less expensive more reliable and predictable AEG would do much much better in terms of total numbers. With our luck if they do decide to make one they'll make the embarrassing tanker version (not used in WW2) thinking it would be more popular as its shorter and more portable.
Ahhhhhhh. That would make me very very sad.
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Post by m5a11943 on Oct 14, 2009 5:45:43 GMT -5
Guys into airsoft are not the only ones who would buy a cheap Garand. I have noticed several blank burner reenactors buying the airsoft guns just for display. Almost to the man every reenactor in the 82nd ABN had bought an M1A1, they even have a group photo of themselves with their M1A1's. So the demand is out there.
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Sgt_Tom
Technical Sgt.
Combat!
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Oct 14, 2009 8:24:43 GMT -5
Ah well a Tanker Garand wouldn't be too hard to convert to a longer version. It seems to me they'd make both as making the reg version would be virtually hardly anymore money to make.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 14, 2009 11:24:05 GMT -5
I am hoping when and if they come out with a Garand AEG the conversion days will be over! Hopefully we won't have to mess with "enhancements" augmentations, revisions or redos on anything. A tanker version would be just plain awful. It would require a new barrel or barrel extension, a replacement handguard and who knows what else in the way of tweaks. The tanker version was strictly post war and wasn't popular as a sport rifle in any event.
I have often thought however if I was full bore manufacturer how cool it would be to make the clips look cooler than the plain Janes I make. (Bullet shapes and the proper patten from the enblock clips at the rear.) The proper looking base plate could either be hinged or attached and easily removed. (Magnets?)
I continue to dream.
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deacon
Private 1st Class
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Post by deacon on Oct 14, 2009 21:35:07 GMT -5
ok, you guys got me now. I have to create a top loading M1 aeg.
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Seff
Private
.30-06 - Turning Cover into Concealment since 1906
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Post by Seff on Oct 15, 2009 7:05:17 GMT -5
I already have the principle for a top loading M1 AEG worked out, but it's all theory.
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WhiteRook
Private
Unofficial Awesome
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Post by WhiteRook on Oct 15, 2009 17:03:45 GMT -5
Heck, I'd buy one even if it didn't load from the top!
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Post by hairy apple on Oct 15, 2009 19:33:22 GMT -5
Honestly, I think a top loading garand would be kinda dumb, there is already a well proven design, it works great. Why change it? Realism, I guess... but there are so many parts for a standerd m14 gearbox why go with something rare? Eh.
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Post by CharleyNovember on Oct 15, 2009 19:53:38 GMT -5
I don't know but one of those bb loaders in the shape of a clip for a Garand that you pulled back the bolt and feed 8-15 rounds into an internal mag from the top would be pretty pimptastic.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 16, 2009 16:43:59 GMT -5
I was still thinking bottom loader when I suggested it. Keep things simple and minimize tooling requirements. Top loading with anything large like an enblock is just too outside the box relative to a tradiional AEG gearbox design. Look how leng it took them to come up with the traditional non pistol grip gearbox of the M14. That in itself was a huge adaptation that opned up lots of possibilities (Most still unrealized except by custom builders)
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Post by bizcuits on Oct 19, 2009 13:06:56 GMT -5
Sadly a poll like this will never show the real potential in for the market of an AEG garand.
As others have mentioned there are many more potential buyers then just what is here on WW2AA.
Hell at SacAirsoft, when the GAS M1 garand came out about 5 people in our community bought them, just to have a garand. Most never even considered the WW2 theme. They just wanted a garand.
Add in thousands more like them, plus re-enactors and other collectors, plus the number of WW2 Airsofters who don't visit WW2AA.
When I bought a Mp40 from the local AEX last year, I asked how many they'd sold recently. I was told I was buying one of the last two and they'd already sold about a hundred. I asked why, the manager mentioned a lot of the guns were being bought by kids who wanted the gun from Call of Duty: World @ War.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 19, 2009 14:43:26 GMT -5
I absolutely agree that the numbers of sales for a reasonably realistic AEG garand would be fantastic. In the thousands quite literally and quite quickly. I know there is a lot of pent up demand. Given the pricing on Chinese clone Marui M14s. I have to believe they could come in at well under $200.00 (plastic simulated wood, bottom loaders) Real wood would naturally be a logical option as would spare clips, leather slings, sniper variant components.
As with most airsoft guns, most will go to plinkers and chairsofters but who cares. It's been over five years since I made my first conversion and almost 300 rifles later I can't believe none of the manufacturers recognize this niche. For God sake it's probably the most recognized military rifle in history with the exception of the AK and M16. Certainly the most significant. The realtively low sales numbers for the Marushin Gas Garand probably effect their enthusiasm but that's a gun saddled with a high operating cost and poor reputation for reliability and skirmishability. It sold inspite of itself.
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Post by mischief on Oct 19, 2009 17:35:50 GMT -5
Did they ever come up with a fix for the part that always broke?
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 19, 2009 19:31:36 GMT -5
That was the least of that guns challenges. The gun shoots erratically, can only hold enough gas for around 50 shots (assuming it fires that many without jamming) was extremely inconsistent to load the clips in and required the owner to tighten a dozen screws about every 100 shots even if you used loctite on them. Assuming you found all that required tightening and stayed on top of it the gun might stay intact without breaking for 500 rounds. I owned 2 of them and loved them when they were working. I knew going in they wouldn't be skirmishable but I expected them to be more durable than that. Obviously an AEG was the way to go for a semi auto rifle.
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Post by Fusilier on Oct 19, 2009 20:43:47 GMT -5
As with most airsoft guns, most will go to plinkers and chairsofters but who cares. It's been over five years since I made my first conversion and almost 300 rifles later I can't believe none of the manufacturers recognize this niche. For God sake it's probably the most recognized military rifle in history with the exception of the AK and M16. Certainly the most significant. The realtively low sales numbers for the Marushin Gas Garand probably effect their enthusiasm but that's a gun saddled with a high operating cost and poor reputation for reliability and skirmishability. It sold inspite of itself. >> I agree! The same can be said for the PPSH-41. Another weapon built in the millions,but we have yet to see one.I myself would love a good, skirmishable Garand,and/or M1 carbine. Thompsons are great,but every other GI didn't have one.
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CptJericho
Private 1st Class
"We got to stop the Germans from getting the secret weapons!"
Posts: 495
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Post by CptJericho on Oct 20, 2009 18:50:48 GMT -5
The poll is going very well, 23 votes yes, 6 votes maybe, and 1 no(I do not know who would ever vote no to a well priced garand) in only 8 days!!!
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Post by drunkalbertan on Oct 21, 2009 21:03:12 GMT -5
If I could buy an M1 Garand for $250 I would buy 10 of them in an instant. However, importing them into Canada they would be seized at the border instantly and destroyed shortly there after. If they made it thru the border on the other hand, they would most easily sell for roughly $750-$850 Cdn(675 US). Airsoft in this country has been slowly eroded over time and WW2 era weapons are few and far between with a high demand.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 22, 2009 16:30:05 GMT -5
Canada completely sucks when it comes to airsoft. What a shame since John Garand was Canadian. I have sold 3 kits (components needed to build your own on your own M14 into Canada) and each one got through although I believe that was a considerably risk. Each buyer agreed to accept the responsibility.
It was spooky each time.
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