2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 30, 2010 1:45:23 GMT -5
I ran across the nose assembly for a SMLE and ladder site quite inexpensively at the gun show last weekend and decided to build a SMLE conversion.
I was inspired by Jimquirri who did an awesome job on his but didn't want to go to the expense or effort of his approach which used the actual stocks and handguards along with many many take off parts.
Since I was in the middle of a bunch of Springfield conversions I had some extra Bar 10s so I figured what the heck. I essentially followed Hairey Apples approach by sticking with the BAR 10 main stock assembly.
The first thing I did was looked at as many pictures of the SMLE and it variants as I could. I copied line drawings and photographs to use to guide my efforts and jotted down the dimensions. 44.5 inches long. The version I decided on was the classic Smelly with the snub nosed end. It soldiered with the British Army and most of her former colonies since before WW1 and are still seen in the mountains of Afghanistan so it's a great prop for mil sim. (I always thought it was an iconic bolt action rifle. Ugly as hell. So much so that it's cool)
The first thing I did was cut the tip of the BAR 10 stock off. I learned from a previous mistake and instead of cutting the stock right at the bulkhead in front of the hop up I cut it farther up to insure I'd have a channel area to extend a brace from the stock into my custom extension. (A couple inches is all you need) I also cut off the rubber butt plate pad. This leaves an exposed hollow butt stock which I covered with a butt plate that replicates the brass butt plate on the SMLE.
Because with my approach so much weight is added to the forestock area this hollow butt stock needed to be weighted and filled with resin paste so the rifle ended up with decent balance. It used lots and lots of resin paste however. The added heft adds a sense of solidness to the conversion and people always seem to equate weight with quality. It certainly feels more authentic.
I cut just a few inches off the tip of the fat VSR style barrel where on most bolt action conversions you remove a great deal of this fat outer barrel. I added a short length of brass tubing as the barrel tip and extended it well into the fatter outer barrel securing it to both the fat outer barrel and the 6.03 inner barrel using rolled tape as the spacers. This works remarkably well. You can add or subtract tape until you have a snug fit.
I then placed masking tape on the bottom surface of the fat VSR barrel and smeared it with release wax so it would come apart when finished and facilitate repairs or upgrades.
Below the barrel I used a wood dowel cut to length and extended it into the two inch recess in the Bar 10 stock. I temporarily held it all in place with masking tape. I cut into the bottom surface of the dowel at the muzzle so the SMLE nose piece would align properly and using the screw hole screwed it into place at the tip of the dowel.
I then used dyna glass resin paste and filled in around the dowel. In addition I slopped it on between the dowel and the VSR barrel and after several coats (allowing time to dry in between I ended up with essentially a fat glop of dyna glass resin paste extending from the VSR stock all the way up to the tip of the SMLE. I thickly coated over the VSR barrel as well as below and on both sides of the dowel.
Once dry I used a belt sander and shaped it all down to a reasonably close shape in sync with the shape of a SMLE. In addition I cut and reshaped the butt stock area to look more like the SMLE which is quite distinctive.
After several layers and sanding efforts I used the dremel to cut a seam between what would become the upper handguards and the complete lower stock. I follwed the upper surface of the lower stock all the way to the tip of the newly created stock. Normally the resin would stick to the VSR outer barrel making seperation impossible but I masked it off and applied release wax so it came off with a little bit of effort. I then pulled off the tape and filled in a few gaps in my stock extension that hadn't completely filled. With the dowel inside the resin fill it's a very solid one piece, lower stock. The handguard pieces are thin and simply cover the old fat VSR barrel. Normally you have to do a lot of sanding to get the actual handguards to fit and wind up with a thin veneer of wood.
Again using my dremel I in essence sculpted the SMLE into what once was the resin glop. A band of resin paste at the stock neck visually simulates the metal band that attaches the butt stock on an Enfield.
I added the Enfield box magazine, an actual stock band, a fashioned butt plate, the small wings at the ladder site and the shaped walls that anchored the site and installed the actual SMLE ladder site I bought.
With some final touch up and paint work the gun was finished. The whole project cost as follows. $100.00 for the Bar10. $20.00 for the SMLE nose piece. $20.00 for the stock band and sling hardware $18.00 for the ladder site and roughly $30.00 for resin, paint, masking tape and sand paper. I worked on it along with other projects I had going on and finished it in five days.
I took pictures of the process and will post them in this tutorial as soon as I get them downloaded. This was somewhat harder than I had envisioned but was by far the easiest conversion I've ever done and while far from perfect came out quite good for the money and time invested.
A custom bolt action rifle for under $200.00. It feels great,(nice weight and balance) is solid as a rock, shoots awesome, is fully disassemble capable and because it is based on the Bar 10 can use all Marui upgraded parts. The hop up functions as it normally does and the 30 round magazine loads in the bottom directly in front of the fake SMLE magazine.
The rifle can be easily cocked from the shoulder and fires currently at 465 to 478 FPs with .20 gram. There is obviously some additional detail work that could be done to further enhance the illusion but it never was my intent to have anything exceptionally precise with this particular project.
As with so many of these thing it's not something that makes sense to pursue commercially. Even on this simple project the labor time adds up quickly. but I highly recommend it as a fairly simple, do it yourself WW2 conversion.
Much, much easier than the fully modified actual stock work and truth be told is more functional and will no doubt be less troublesome.
A fun shooter and nice addition to my little armory. As I stare at it I'm reminded that the British were underpaid, under sexed and under Eisenhower. Ta, ta, pip, pip, and all that bloddy rot.
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Post by jimmiroquai on Oct 30, 2010 3:32:58 GMT -5
Can't wait to see it! I'm intirgued by the very unique approach!
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kalbs
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Post by kalbs on Oct 30, 2010 20:35:18 GMT -5
Can't wait either. I want a SMLE too
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 31, 2010 13:21:17 GMT -5
Got all the pictures downloaded to my computer but the hosting site appears to be down. The approach is so simple (compared to most conversions) and while certainly not perfect provides an attractive, viable WW2 looking rifle that should work well for our purposes until and actual replica becomes available. The final detail and finish work took longer than I had anticipated but is generally my favorite part. Three days total time for the build along with other distractions and projects. (Real work and my Garand customers)
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 6, 2010 2:38:53 GMT -5
Still having challenges with my host site and unable to rotate and resize but here are some pictures such as they are: Here is a picture that gives an idea about the approach. Note how significantly I revised the appearance of the Bar 10 plastic stock Next pictures shows the long dowel which provides significant strength to the applied dyna glass resin. I taped the lower part of the VSR barrel and applied mold release so once pasted into shape I could dremel cut the upper handguard area from the lower stock once finished so I could still dissasemble the rifle Several different rifles shown as I did a batch of them: SMLEs distinctive muzzle: Simulated wood (resin epoxy paste shaped and painted) Right side 1st rifle I finished: Mag area, note that on the first rifles I did, the butt stock band (which was just built up resin paste shaped and painted) was farther back than it should have been. This was corrected on the last two I made They aren't perfect of course and a guy could do additional detail work to further the illussion. My goal was to keep costs low, have a skirmishable rifle that would be recognized for the rifle it represents and I think I achieved that
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Post by jimmiroquai on Nov 6, 2010 18:13:49 GMT -5
Wow! It turned out great, even with the bar10 stock.
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kalbs
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Post by kalbs on Nov 6, 2010 18:49:20 GMT -5
I'm watching this build closely. I have some SMLE parts on there way to me. Looks great 2ndbat
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 7, 2010 1:57:39 GMT -5
They do not match the beauty of Jimquoirris and I knew they wouldn't (There really is no match for using the real thing as a base and simulating wood is never as nice but given the materials used and the limitations presented, they came out quite satisfactory exceeding my own expectations. I am quite pleased with them.
This was a fun project. I hope the pictures and explanation helps generate further interest in home builds. My fear was that once created they wouldn't come apart but the taping of the lower portion of the Bar 10 outer barrel and liberal use of green grease mold release meant once everything was shaped by cutting down a seam that would normally have existed between the upper handguards and the lower stock the rifle seperated pretty much as normal with just a little bit of drama. I just dremeled into the resin right down to the metal follwing the original height of the lower stock
The upper handguards thus become permanently affixed to the outer barrel and receiver group but this in no way effects disassembly upgrades or repairs. Be sure to mask off a gap where the hop up needs to function. Note that to create the SMLE lower stock shape I built up the lower stock slightly through the area where the magazine goes and slightly forward. On the most recent one I built I was able to create an especially nice wood grain finish and I took the time to add some additional small detail finishing touches.
Regimental disc, and small chain connecting the stock to the magazine. Should I happen upon some volley sights for a reasonable amount I'll add them. At present I built six of them in total and managed to get them all finished in slightly more than two weeks from start to finish while finishing other projects as well. (Admittedly my real work load these past two weeks has been light.)
I'll try to post pictures of this final finished variant. Incidently at one point I had several of them stacked up leaning on my Jeep in the garage and they all came crashing down onto the cement garage floor landing in a heap. No damage whatsoever which I think is pretty impressive.
They are well balanced, have a nice weight to them and should be fun, durable rifles. I was on a bolt action terror these last two weeks as I have now finished three more Springfields as well as another small batch of Garands and a Cz 24
In terms of materials cost and time required the SMLE has been the least challenging yet. $185.00 or so in materials and perhaps 18 to 22 hours of labor. I sold several for $550.00 each and was happy to do so but in reality working at $15.00 an hour makes little sense. These projects definitely make the most sense as a do-it yourself project unless you can find someone you can exploit by taking advantage of the fact that they enjoy it.
With each build I got a little better and the final three came out especially nice.
Fun rifles to shoot. The butt stock shape of course is not perfect but I don't think anyone reasonably knowledgable about weapons would mistake it for anything but a SMLE and even quite knowledgable persons would be hardpressed to spot the infidelities without an actual side by side comparison.
At reasonable range crossing a field or wooded area with a good Brit impression they definitly beat a burlap wrapped AK 47!
I took lots of pictures of the assorted builds so if you want to take it on let me know and I'll be happy to send a photo tutorial
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Apr 3, 2011 21:54:58 GMT -5
The final build count on the SMLEs was eight and a couple ended up requiring far more time and effort due to unforseen challenges with the base rifles. Such is the lot when one builds custom rifles and a further case for not bothering with it commercially. I ended up assembling and disassembling one of the rifles multiple times before I finally got it functioning properly and still don't know for sure what the problem (or solution) was.
I encourage everyone to take on this project yourself but have no interest in building them other than for my own personal use.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 11, 2011 15:27:47 GMT -5
Left over components and a little idle time have prompted me to knock out a few more of these. If I come up with any new revelations I will post them. This is such an iconic weapon and a really easy and inexpensive build out.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Aug 12, 2012 17:17:31 GMT -5
I just finished my 11th SMLE and took a very different approach. A forum member sent me an actual demilled SMLEy and commissioned me to marry it with a BAR 10. The project looked far easier than it turned out to be but I finally finishec it using as much of the Original components as possible.
I added a few additional touches of authenticity on the receiver group area and was happy with these details.
The real wood obviously looks better up close than the resin paste wood finish and the trim elements are essentially spot on. Will post pictures before shipping it to my client. i love the way it shoots and feels. An actual bayonet fits perfectly and feels solid on the rifle although I wouldnt recommend using it on a bayonet course. The SMLE actual stock was too thin for the VSR components unless I was willing to go with paper thin stock walls (which I wasn't) I blended the actual rear butt stock and actual forearm and handguards into a cut down VSR center stock area. The front and rear stock bands on the Enfield do a great job of camoflaging the blend. I was especially pleased with the way the simulated finish matched the actual wood. I am building another for myself.
Subsequent note: The second one I ultimately built and sold to another Forum member who I hope will get years of enjoyment out of.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Sept 17, 2015 19:18:47 GMT -5
Since its now been several years since the last SMLE I built I went back through this thread as I am fabricating a couple lower stocks for Dracul. In addition to the 11 basic SMLEs I also made a couple using derelic demilled rifles and one using a Demix replica. (The Demix rifle was quite hard to convert as the stocks and handguards were solid with no inletting whatsoever)
I bought a BAR 10 so I can insure everything will fit and function leaving all the upper finish work to Dracul. Since Drac is using actual upper handguards I will have to utilize a long section of 1\2 inch tubing for a thinner outer barrel.
The rear upper handguard will need lots of dremel work to fit snug to the shroud \ barrel from the VSR where it covers the hop up. As I recall the forward section will require so as well but not as much.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 23, 2015 12:21:43 GMT -5
A health issue and the wedding of my middle daughter pulled me off this project for some time but I am back on it with earnest. It's frankly a little harder knowing someone else will be doing the final finish work as everything has to be precise and all set for them. I got one BAR 10 to use as the mule for alignment and fitting for both lower stocks.
Dracul sent me his actual upper handguards which I will attempt to match stain wise. The rear handguard will need to be inletted considerably to fit and both handguards should probably be permanently affixed to the pull out BAR 10s used for strength and durability. This will still allow disassembly and repairs to the airsoft components.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 26, 2015 21:18:52 GMT -5
To properly insure a precise fit and alignment I had to adapt Draculs actual handguards otherwise the modified forearm would be an approximation. I spent the day dremeling and fitting these parts to these two rifles. The handguards for an SMLE come in two parts. A long skinny handguard the slips under the iconic SMLE muzzle piece and extends back and slightly wraps around the rear ladder sight. The rear hand guard is short and stubby and wraps around the back side of the sight and extends back just in front of the receiver group. The thin legs of the front handguard needed to have the tips dremeled to very thin veneers in order to marry up with the cut down original VSR outer barrel which is cut just in front of the hop up. Without shaving the tips the handguard presents too much of a downward angle to the muzzle.
To match up and alighn the rear handguard it had to be very carefully dremeled to almost paper thin veneers in some places to fit snugly on the VSR outer barrel and receiver group housing. This handguard will need to be glued or resin filled directly to the upper portion of the VSR rifle. Otherwise it would be too fragile.
To provide a proper fit for the actual handguards in addition to the dremel work I also elected to go with a thinner outer barrel than the half inch copper tubing I have used in the past. Instead I found a smaller tube which is available in either steel or aluminum. It is small enough on the outside to slide into the 1\2 inch copper tubing while still having enough room to slide over any actual BB barrel. It's so snug that one or two wraps of tape are all you need for each barrel spacer. The steel though hard to cut is rigid and provides a little weight. Moving forward on other projects a progression of the copper tube and steel barrel could simulate a tapered barrel.
More to follow with pictures. This approach is definitely more time intensive that the "bondo buggy" SMLEs I originally knocked out but less work than marrying an actual SMLE or Denix replica to the VSR internals. The visual results will likewise be somewhere in between.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 27, 2015 0:48:16 GMT -5
For this project I decided to use the metal M14 housings I have laying around. (Literally hundreds!) To fabricate the iconic SMLE magazines. I drew the shape and then using a dremel cut them out. (Tough cuts). They were not quite long enough for the 303 magazine but there was plenty of material to extend the length. Initially I was concerned that the magazine would extend over the center VSR attachment bolt but I sliced the back wall a little bit so it will extend a little bit over the trigger guard. I will mount it permanently to the stock with resin paste and screws drilled in through from the base of the stock. The mounting bolt is immediately in front of the magazine and of course immediately in front of it is the VSR magazine. These are coming together nicely.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Oct 29, 2015 11:55:00 GMT -5
This entire approach is far more labor intense than my original CHEAP SMLEs as they were literally done without disassembling the VSR gun at all. I used a dremel to cut out and reshape the butt stock. On those first ones I cut the tip of the plastic stock and removed the very end of the fat VSR outer barrel. Attached a dowel for the stock extension and slipped dyna glass resin everywhere and then grinding and sanding things into shape. The upper handguards were literally pasted right onto the VSR outer barrel. The magazines were cut and shaped pieces of wood. When done I dremeled a cut along the base of the newly created handguards and separated the rifle halves to facilitate repairs or upgrades. I literally could make six of them in four days. (Which I did). For that project the intact rifle served as the brace for alignment and greatly speeded up production.
This current approach is nearly as labor intense as modifying an actual rifle or a Denix replica but does eliminate the need for the donor parts other than the muzzle piece which is relatively cheap. ($10.00 to $15.00). In addition each project rifle requires about $15.00 in resin paste and perhaps another $20.00 in dremel bits sandpaper stains and dyes.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 20, 2015 1:15:05 GMT -5
I am nearing completion on these two SMLEs with final cosmetic finish and a few minor details. The client for this project will add rear sites and any receiver group details along with slings and hardware otherwise these are two fully assembled rifles. Not at all the project we originally discussed and certainly not what I had imagined.
As with every new approach I learned a lot and am extremely pleased with how these came out. One remaining piece of drama. I mounted the two rear handguards permanently to the Bar 10 hardware and slopped resin paste to fill the thin gap that existed between the lower stock and this handguard. Once dry and solid I will sand down to create a smooth marriage between the two halves and once done will use my dremel to cut a thin seam straight into the inner BAR 10 metal (easy to know by sound and sparks when you get there!). Once done the hope and prayer is that with these seams the upper\ inner components and the entire lower stock assembly will still separate. Yikes! Keep your fingers crossed. I see no reason why they shouldn't?
To insure function prior to this final structural work I put over 100 rounds through each rifle and love the way they shoot and feel. Solid, heavy impressive rifles.
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Dracul
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Post by Dracul on Nov 26, 2015 22:37:02 GMT -5
Got some SMLE loving right here, these are for me, too! Had some big deals going down with 2ndBat for these!
With the gap between the handguards and lower stocks filled and sanded to blend I had to essentially redo the finish. I began with the acrylic yellow ochre applied with a thick brush to create "wood grain" The butt stocks were not effected by the revision so they were left untouched. The bottoms of the VSR magazines were also finished to help them blend. Obviously the metal bits were masked off. once oversprayed and dull coated the finish is quite convincing. The filled gaps from my initial effort was a worthwhile detail. the rear sites need to be added and additional details to the receiver group can be added to further the Enfield impression. the "brass" butt plate is a nice touch I think. Flat head screws need to be added. A gap in the sidewall to accomodate the hopups can be seen in the rifle to the left. The rear hand guard is permanently affixed to the VSR hardware but the forward heat shield comes off as it would on the actual gun.
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Dracul
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Post by Dracul on Nov 26, 2015 22:41:31 GMT -5
Got the finished "glamour shots" here. I can't wait until I get these in! Gotta get going on getting the rear sites on my end.
I held these one day longer than I needed to so I could get these pictures. You can clearly see the gap filler up front but the gap filler beneath the rear handguard is quite subtle and came out nice. side shot. upper view. Note the slightly different finishes. I wanted seperate personalities for the two rifles. glamour shot. The Faux wood finish I think is quite good. the rifles themselves are not as shiney as they appear in these pictures.
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stuka
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Post by stuka on Nov 27, 2015 11:27:39 GMT -5
very cool 2nd bat
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Post by insterburger on Nov 27, 2015 12:43:32 GMT -5
+1 on Stuka's assessment. They may not be letter-perfect, but the profile is spot-on and from any reasonable distance these scream out "Smelly." If these started showing up in quantity, we might be able to get some Brits into the fray. About the only guy out East doing UK is Drac, and he needs company! A solitary specialized impression mixed in among the ranks is awkward at best, but two or three... now you've got a sub-unit!
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Dracul
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Post by Dracul on Nov 27, 2015 13:06:16 GMT -5
Its going to be my goal! Between these 2, a STEN, and a ZB.26 (as a BREN), I'll have a near legit fire team worth of Commonwealth guns, but I'm not there yet with the kits. I have plenty of post-war, adopted by other countries, battledress and gear, but most of it needs a lot of elbow grease. P49 trousers need a lot of work to make them P37 like, most Greek BD blouses are green and need dying, all the gear needs recoloring, too. Just stuff I haven't had time for yet.
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stuka
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Post by stuka on Nov 27, 2015 13:17:56 GMT -5
are you going to modify the zb at all? From my understanding, the germans used them so you could claim it captured =P
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Dracul
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Post by Dracul on Nov 27, 2015 14:11:48 GMT -5
I thought about it, but the work would need a lot of equipment I just don't have and can't use in an apartment. Its close enough, to be honest, but to anyone who complains I can easily say its "captured" since it was used by the Germans a lot after they took over Czechoslovakia. If I remember correctly, too, the SS had the one Czech arms factory (that made the ZB.26 and 30) continuing making them.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 28, 2015 1:35:47 GMT -5
These are substantially nicer than the very very basic ones Initially made. Not quite as nice as the ones made from actual SMLEs but very very close.
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Dracul
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Post by Dracul on Nov 28, 2015 17:40:58 GMT -5
So, I just now handed off my SMLE rear sight assembly to my buddy with a 3D Printer, he is going to try to recreate two of them for me in ABS plastic.
Its going to be a simple one piece thing, airsoft guns don't really need elevation adjustment, since thats all the hopup, and it can rest at the lowest yard setting.
Will update when I learn more from him. Hopefully I'll get them in time for OXCC Battle of the Bulge in a few weeks.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jan 11, 2016 16:11:53 GMT -5
How has your progress been on fabricating sights? Actual ones turn up from time to time at gun shows for pretty reasonable money. A ready access fabrication would be nice so sourcing isn't so spotty. I agree that fixed fabrications are fine for airsoft. Kentucky windage and eyeball adjustments being the norm for airsoft.
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Dracul
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Post by Dracul on Jun 22, 2018 20:28:38 GMT -5
I know I'm extremely late on this, but I'm still easing my way back in, haha. I did up some models and prints to visually add to the SMLEs I got from 2ndBat (earlier in the thread). Well, one is finished at least. These are not meant to be exact, correct, or considered replicated or repro, or even to be utilized outside of looks. Just dressing them up to further resemble a proper, issued SMLE, instead of something that barely made it out of the factory. I'm still on the fence about adding to the bolt area. Parts were printed in a stronger co-poly material, and can withstand intense heat and weather, probably some roughing up, too. But I wouldn't count on that, and definitely would NOT use the sling rings to sling the rifle, or to even put sling on it, except for pics. Because these parts are small and unpainted, any breakage can be cheaply and quickly replaced. I feel the stock rings and sights can hold up to practical use. Enough talk, picture time: Visually, huge improvements. While still f a r b y by natural, at least it sticks out as SMLE. Front sight post. More of the front end. Rear sight. Looks messy, but I had heat shape it so the assembly would seat all the way. Sights do align, but honestly, I don't know if they are off from the trajectory at all. While I upgraded the internals, I kept the FPS at about 400, (to engage under 100ft) so its not like its going be used for "sniping" and the front site guards are probably well enough to be used to line up shots at airsoft ranges. Rear of the rifle. It took maybe a week of on-and-off test fitting parts and such. I plan on tackling the other SMLE I got the same way in the upcoming weeks. (wow, I got Star Trek on the screen, got lightsabers on walls, 3D printer filament and figures and video game consoles all over. If you guys didn't know how much of a nerd I am, you guys sure do now!)
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Post by volkssturm on Jun 22, 2018 23:14:47 GMT -5
I've got a cheap SMLE (No. 1 Mk. III). Got it in Anchorage back in 1973 for $30. Made by BSA in 1917. Those were the days. On the other hand, I think I was making about $500 a month then. Just thought I'd mention that, because I'm old and nostalgic.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jun 23, 2018 16:56:30 GMT -5
Drac, I think your enhancements look great. 3 D printing the assorted bits could result in a very cheap and easy to do conversion that actually shoots well and could be quite skirmishable.
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