Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Jan 31, 2012 16:08:51 GMT -5
Does anyone know a good source for detailed B.A.R Rifle measurements. I think I've seen some posted on here before. Thanks to anyone who can help!
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HornetWSO
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Post by HornetWSO on Jan 31, 2012 18:05:47 GMT -5
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Post by volkssturm on Jan 31, 2012 18:37:12 GMT -5
Here's somebody selling plans for $10 replicaplans.com/BrowningM1918A2.htmlI knowsomeone here had a link to blueprints at one time, because I copied off part of it. Just for the heckuvit I just bought these plans. I'd say they're worth $9.99, especially if you can work with CAD. I don't. His ordering is a bit flaky. I used Paypal (since I had a little cash in it). He gets your email address from Paypal and emails the plans, but the process is not very informative. It's like "I just sent you ten bucks, what happens now?" But about ten minutes later I got the email. I just realized. That's actually the same place as Hornet posted. Just a different page of his website. |
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Jan 31, 2012 20:18:38 GMT -5
Yea I found that john-tom guy on Google. I'd rather have a free one obviously but I guess if no one knows the place I'll have to buck up and pay. I don't really need anything too detailed either as I am just making a prop weapon.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jan 31, 2012 22:19:54 GMT -5
If you're going to use the M14 as a base(which I think is the most logical) No matter what you do your M14 motor will be just a tiny bit wider than the BAR and the overall height of the BAR receiver group will likewise be a tiny bit taller than it should be. I don't find it especially detracting but obviously some people would find it unacceptable. I traced my receiver group shape and overall dimensions from an actual gun and used the tracings to do up my templates. I should have taken measurements but frankly it never occured to me.
By taking somewhat extensive efforts to thin out the gear box as much as you can without internal redesigns the M14 gear box once covered with sheet metal sides, ends up about an 1/8th of inch too wide and likewise an 8th of an inch too tall where it meets the barrel. You obviously have to lengthen the barrel and use a fatter outer barrel than on the M14. Some of the things you can do to narrow the M14 gear box is eliminate the selector switch and hardware completely, reroute the wiring that goes along the side of the motor and remove the nubs that channeled the wiring. My last two BARs (Number six and seven) were both done with this thinner approach and used actual metal side plates which was a nice improvement over the ABS or wood sideplates I had used in the past. Incidently I am nearly finished with number seven which is finished except it still needs the rear site, the sling hardware and the charging bolt installed (non functional) It's a fun project and I will post more pictures in my tutorial when I return from my current work trip.
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Post by volkssturm on Feb 1, 2012 12:10:37 GMT -5
I found the pages that I saved a few years ago. I only have the receiver. I think they came from someone here, but I don't recall who.   |
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Feb 1, 2012 15:21:04 GMT -5
I found the pages that I saved a few years ago. I only have the receiver. I think they came from someone here, but I don't recall who. Thanks but do those pictures come in bigger sizes as I can't read the measurements? If you're going to use the M14 as a base(which I think is the most logical) No matter what you do your M14 motor will be just a tiny bit wider than the BAR and the overall height of the BAR receiver group will likewise be a tiny bit taller than it should be. I don't find it especially detracting but obviously some people would find it unacceptable. I traced my receiver group shape and overall dimensions from an actual gun and used the tracings to do up my templates. I should have taken measurements but frankly it never occured to me. By taking somewhat extensive efforts to thin out the gear box as much as you can without internal redesigns the M14 gear box once covered with sheet metal sides, ends up about an 1/8th of inch too wide and likewise an 8th of an inch too tall where it meets the barrel. You obviously have to lengthen the barrel and use a fatter outer barrel than on the M14. Some of the things you can do to narrow the M14 gear box is eliminate the selector switch and hardware completely, reroute the wiring that goes along the side of the motor and remove the nubs that channeled the wiring. My last two BARs (Number six and seven) were both done with this thinner approach and used actual metal side plates which was a nice improvement over the ABS or wood sideplates I had used in the past. Incidently I am nearly finished with number seven which is finished except it still needs the rear site, the sling hardware and the charging bolt installed (non functional) It's a fun project and I will post more pictures in my tutorial when I return from my current work trip. Thanks for the info 2nd Bat. I am probably just going to do it from scratch as I don't have an M14 to spare right now. |
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Feb 1, 2012 15:45:18 GMT -5
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Post by volkssturm on Feb 1, 2012 22:58:53 GMT -5
If you save off the two pics I posted, you can put them in Photoshop, Paintshop or another editor and enlarge them to where you can read them. Unfortunately, the quality isn't that greeat, but it looks like the width of the receiver is 1.521 inch. The plans from Tomlinson say to make the receiver (it's solid) from 4 10mm sheets, which makes it 3-4 mm wider than 1.5 inch. Like 2nd Bat said a while back, it's amazingly thin.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Feb 3, 2012 19:44:56 GMT -5
The actual dimensions are worthwhile if you are making a replica non firing gun but if you plan to make it a functional airsoft weapons you are going to have to accept some infidelities or do some extensive modifications to a gear box.
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Feb 3, 2012 21:03:22 GMT -5
Very true. This will be the first prop only gun I've made in a long while.
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Feb 8, 2012 15:35:29 GMT -5
In that case by all means do what you can to get the shape and sizes as perfect as possible.
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 13, 2012 8:32:27 GMT -5
Does anyone know the size of a B.A.R barrel? Is it the same size as an M1 Garand barrel or larger?
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2nd Bat
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Post by 2nd Bat on Apr 13, 2012 14:14:21 GMT -5
The barrel is both larger and longer.
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 13, 2012 15:06:48 GMT -5
Any idea of the exact size? I know its longer but what is the width?
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HornetWSO
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Post by HornetWSO on Apr 13, 2012 17:26:26 GMT -5
Check out Oddball on you tube, he builds the BAR from scratch and post the dimensions in depth
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Post by jettalewis on Apr 13, 2012 21:04:32 GMT -5
I've looked at his BAR before and checked it out again. He did a fine job, but he had a demilled BAR to use as a size guide and a well stocked shop to build it in. I think I would rather pay the 9 bucks for a set of plans and exact shapes to cut out. Then, if you have a mig welder, lathe and a well stocked shop of tools and misc junk you will be pretty well set. Otherwise, you could probably make it out of ABS. I've thought about this build, but after watching this again I doubt I will try it  |
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 13, 2012 23:04:02 GMT -5
I've looked at his BAR before and checked it out again. He did a fine job, but he had a demilled BAR to use as a size guide and a well stocked shop to build it in. I think I would rather pay the 9 bucks for a set of plans and exact shapes to cut out. Then, if you have a mig welder, lathe and a well stocked shop of tools and misc junk you will be pretty well set. Otherwise, you could probably make it out of ABS. I've thought about this build, but after watching this again I doubt I will try it Yea I am just making a prop gun. I am using mostly wood with a few metal parts like the barrel and butt plate. |
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Post by mastermike95 on Apr 13, 2012 23:08:01 GMT -5
Im glad you guys posted these measurments. Recently ive been thinking about making a prop BAR for my movies.
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Post by jettalewis on Apr 14, 2012 16:20:42 GMT -5
In that case sgttom you should be good to go How about posting some pics of the completed gun? Or even better, your progress. I bet you could make a heck of a reciever out of wood. |
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 14, 2012 18:24:27 GMT -5
My good camera isn't turning on and the other ones battery charger is lost so I can't post any pictures unfortunately. I cut out the basic receiver, stock, handguard shape. I just gotta do the sanding for it now. I need to finish it by May 19th for a movie. So it will be done soon.
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Post by volkssturm on Apr 14, 2012 21:36:40 GMT -5
Hmmmm. An ethical dilema. I bought the Replicaplans plans, which include the dimension. If I give Sgttom a copy, that would violate their copyright, so I can't do that. But, if I list the dimensions for him, does that violate their copyright? Or just tell Sgttom to fork over the bucks and buy his own plans?  |
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 14, 2012 23:15:39 GMT -5
Its ok. I got the measurements for the stock. So what I did was enlarge a photo of a B.A.R until I got the right stock proportions. Then I just used the rest of the photo as a base for my measurements. I might have bought the plans but in the end I probably wouldn't do it the same way that guide told me to. My measurements might not be 100% correct but no one is going to know the difference.
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Post by jettalewis on Apr 17, 2012 0:53:59 GMT -5
Darn it all to heck sgttom. You have done flung a craving for a BAR right in my face. After reading about this build from several different sources I can see that the most trouble is going to come from the receiver. I'm going to study on this thing the next few days and might, just might, buy a mig welder and play with this part of the build. I know tolerances are tight in this area and have been thinking of a way to gain an 1/8' here or 3/8s there. What really puzzles me is how to make absolutely sure the mag will line up with the hopup feed line.
Another thing that intriegs me is the possibility of using the celluloid stock rather than wood. What do you think of that?
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Post by hairy apple on Apr 17, 2012 2:38:03 GMT -5
Tom! I will get you all the messurements and pictures you want of the real thing. Let me know what you want need. I will take some pictures and email them to you along with any messurements you need.
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 17, 2012 7:54:34 GMT -5
Thanks Hairy. I pretty much got all the measurements I need except for the barrel size though. A measurement of the length of the stock would be nice just to make sure my current measurements are correct. Thanks a bunch! Darn it all to heck sgttom. You have done flung a craving for a BAR right in my face. After reading about this build from several different sources I can see that the most trouble is going to come from the receiver. I'm going to study on this thing the next few days and might, just might, buy a mig welder and play with this part of the build. I know tolerances are tight in this area and have been thinking of a way to gain an 1/8' here or 3/8s there. What really puzzles me is how to make absolutely sure the mag will line up with the hopup feed line. Another thing that intriegs me is the possibility of using the celluloid stock rather than wood. What do you think of that? Have you seen Tommygunner's B.A.R thread? ww2aa.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=technical&action=display&thread=5178About the stock, its seems a wood one would be easier as I don't know how you could make the plastic type. |
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Post by jettalewis on Apr 17, 2012 16:27:39 GMT -5
sgttom, I came across this site and these guys appear to be building a lot of WW11 stuff out of wood. I only looked at the bar and it appears to be ok. Take a look, you might pick up an idea or 2. wn.com/TheShopRats |
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 17, 2012 17:01:44 GMT -5
The B.A.R bipod is a good idea. They probably could have made it much nicer if they used measurements from a real B.A.R. Thanks for the link though. I've been building wooden guns since I was 12 so I think I'll do fine.
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Post by jettalewis on Apr 17, 2012 19:38:29 GMT -5
When I was that age I was very lucky to be living not too far from K&L junkyard. This place was so huge that 3 families actually lived in the middle of the junkyard in homes. Two of the families had boys about my age and then the most wonderful thing happened. K&L purchased thousands of tons of scrap steel from the US Army at Ft. Bragg, NC. This steel consisted of demilled rifles by the thousands. Machine guns by the truck load. Bayonets still in the original wooden crates by the thousands. Buses loaded down with knapsacks, uniforms, belts, first aid kits. Tons of it. Jeeps lined up in rows. I never knew there was a jeep with an ambulance on it until then. Grenades by the truck load. Mess kits piled up 10 or 12 feet. Then we went to WAR. We had a hill that we entrenched 30 cal. water cooled machine guns, piles of grenades. We would don our "uniforms" every Saturday after 12 and Sunday when we could. It was a grand time. Myself and another fellow messed with the jeeps until we finally got one running. Gas came from wrecked autos and we drove all over the junkyard...until the foreman found out. He "confiscated" our jeep and used it on company business. Today, all of it is gone with the exception of one bulldozer and that darned old jeep. It was run until there was no more run in it. Today it is half rotted into the ground and sits just behind the main office by a chainlink fence. At least it was 5 years ago when I last saw it. I never got to make a wood gun, but many of the demilled rifles were 22 cal. Springfield 1903 training rifles. Nearly all were in excellent shape with the exception the barrels and bolts had been cut with a torch. I found two rifles that the barrels had only been touched but not cut and I managed to take bolts apart until I built two bolts that worked just fine. One of those was my "hunting" rifle when I was a kid. Heavy as sin, but a good shooter. That is the reason, one of my first airsoft builds was a 1903.
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Apr 17, 2012 20:27:39 GMT -5
Wow that would have been a dream come true when I was young . I hope all that stuff wasn't scrapped. |
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