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Vampir
Jun 15, 2009 16:41:14 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 15, 2009 16:41:14 GMT -5
Hello all, I'm entirely new to custom works, but I have some time to learn and a bit of cash to buy materials, and I am extremely interested in making a Zg 1229 'Vampir' unit, which was an infrared sight device used by the Nazis in the last months of the war. lh6.ggpht.com/_hVOW2U7K4-M/SdvM9nWMRvI/AAAAAAAA-Theres a picture of it, so I need to ask you guys, how would I go about making this? Any advice on tools, materials, anything, would be helpful. But please don't post just to say that it's a ridiculous idea. Thank you
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Vampir
Jun 15, 2009 21:03:08 GMT -5
Post by lrich on Jun 15, 2009 21:03:08 GMT -5
That's a ridiculous idea, ridiculously awesome ;D
Now as for actually going about making it, it is semi simple, semi hard The easiest way to do this would be to buy an actual night vision monocular, and just make the rest a prop. Obviously the power pack backpack wouldn't be needed as our modern monocular are more efficient . As for the materials, some plastic tubing would probably be easy enough to form to make it look like the Vampir, and just make the inner NV scope workable through the casing. As well for the big "searchlight/illuminator" you have 2 options: Just get a piece of clear plastic and some piping, and make it look like the searchlight or, the more fancy way, get some IR LED's, and a battery pack (and the required resistors and such) and make a big searchlight that you can turn on if you want to illuminate large swaths of land (it will be invisible to the naked eye, but a big spotlight to anyone else with an IR sensitive monocular) Overall, not too hard, just a little building, and a fun project if you have a NV piece and an STG-44
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 1:16:40 GMT -5
Post by 101starmyairborne on Jun 16, 2009 1:16:40 GMT -5
Hey, i'm trying to design a vampir too. One of my ideas was to take telescopic sight and weld a sheet metal "funnel" on top with a strobe inside. spray paint the srobe and hook electric wire to .30 cal boxes on your back. Purely cosmetic but would look pretty sexy. If you are looking to build a real vampir your on your own.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 15:35:18 GMT -5
Post by CharleyNovember on Jun 16, 2009 15:35:18 GMT -5
As a game producer I can tell you most other producers and myself would want you to have a great german impression to match this weapon or we wouldn't want you to field it. Otherwise it will become stupid real fast with a applesauce load of nightfighter germans. Even with that I would not allow more than one and it would need to be a gen 1 nightvision monocular.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 16:57:22 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 16, 2009 16:57:22 GMT -5
Yeah I was thinking a funnel too, but I'm a little worried that it would be too long, the Vampir scope seems to be a legnth between an ACOG and a telescopic sight, with a design similar to an ACOG. Also, if I do make one I will be making the battery box with some false wiring attached, for realism. I don't know yet if I will weight it down so it weighs the realistic 30 pounds or just used it as a standard backpack. CharleyNovember, what would you recommend doing, from a game producers point of view?
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 17:05:42 GMT -5
Post by CharleyNovember on Jun 16, 2009 17:05:42 GMT -5
Make sure you have a great German impression to go along with that weapon. Make it bulky and a pain in the ass to use because the real one was and use a gen 1 nightscope inside it as that is a fairly low tech night aid just like the Vampir was. You can get IR flashlights which is what I would mod to work as your spotlight. Just if you are going to do it make it worth it.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 17:07:16 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 16, 2009 17:07:16 GMT -5
It will be, can you explain the nightsights better, I'm very new to WWII impression, so I don't quite understand the spotlight idea and all that.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 17:13:10 GMT -5
Post by CharleyNovember on Jun 16, 2009 17:13:10 GMT -5
The Vampir system didn't work without an IR illuminator basically a spotlight that lit up the area in front of the rifle but couldn't be seen by the naked eye only through the scope.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 17:19:11 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 16, 2009 17:19:11 GMT -5
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 17:26:12 GMT -5
Post by Garrick Udet on Jun 16, 2009 17:26:12 GMT -5
Echoing CharlieNovember and what I said in another duplicate thread: Why spend all the time and effort on a piece of equipment/impression that was: 1 Very very rare 2 Limited to extremely late war scenarios 3 Practically useless given how rare night engagements are in WW2AA (Yes I realize that The War Department works this into their 2 events every year, but they are it. Also, at long winter, there were numerous flares going up that would have rendered a night vision scope useless).
As an event organizer, I would only allow such a piece of equipment if you are also lugging a heavy battery and IR spotlight. This is assuming that we would do a night scenario in the first place.
I'm not trying to be a killjoy or rain on your respective parades, but my philosophy is to base your impression off of the norm, not the exception. This is why I am encouraging folks to get an MP40 or K98 before an MP44 as well... and why I'm against cammo...etc etc etc.
I know that conformity and uniformity are not qualities endemic to our culture. On this board the need for people to express their individuality and uniqueness is manifested in wanting to base their impressions around something that nobody else has done yet. You will probably experience one of two reactions to this missive of mine, 1st and most likely is that you'll get defensive and dismiss me as some sort of crank and go about building this. Alternatively, you'll stop for a moment, think about it and say to yourself, "hey, this Garrick guy kind of makes sense."
Really the choice is yours. When I started this hobby I too expressed some of these same desires to be different... but what I've found is that your impression really looks the best when you look like the other guys in your unit, and you try to fit in rather than stand out.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 17:31:45 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 16, 2009 17:31:45 GMT -5
Well, I thank you for your response, and if I do come off as defensive I'm sorry. I will continue to build this, not for practicality, but for FUN. I've been airsofting regularly for around 2 1/2 years now, and one thing I've learned is to do it for the fun of it and not get TOO competitive. Yes, its a competitive game, but I do it for fun, not for sport. SO again, garrick, thank you for offering that advice up, but I am going to build this and get as much fun out of it as I can.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 17:53:25 GMT -5
Post by Garrick Udet on Jun 16, 2009 17:53:25 GMT -5
Thanks for not getting tweaked over my opinion.
When I started doing WW2 airsoft, I got into it for the gameplay first and historical aspects second. After 2 years and a dozen or so events, I've discovered that developing the historical accuracy of your impression is almost as much fun as the game itself. Getting into character and maintaining it for a day or two at the event is a blast. Most events are now becoming multi-day affairs where the non-battle periods occupy as much or more time than the battle itself.
My critique is not related to a competitive imbalance that such a device could introduce. We play war. War is not fair. Anything you can do individually to get an edge over your opponent is fair play in my mind. It is up to event organizers to determine which of these enhancements would negatively impact their event and allow/disallow as appropriate.
Really what I am trying to encourage you to do is focus on all the non-weapon related aspects of your impression first. Get that stuff rock solid, then start modding out your gun. Building the core components of your impression to be usable in many periods throughout the war is part of this. Then you can start going for the rare/niche roles that interest you, this might help in finding a unit to fall in with as well.
This is all personal preference, it's your choice what path you go down. I'm just trying to provide some advice based on my experience. Whatever you choose to do, good luck!
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 18:06:58 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 16, 2009 18:06:58 GMT -5
Oh! I gotcha now, thanks Garrick! RIght, well like I said I have a fair amount of cash to spend, but after reading your advice and checking the prices, even repro gear will burn a hole right through my wallet. I still want to keep this project alive, because I already have LOTS of scrap metal and various parts lying around in my garage to do this. Also, I totally get what your saying about the history aspect, which is exactly why I choose the Vampir. You see, I'm not the kind of person that says, hey I wanna be that soldier that looks like all the rest, with the MP40, I'm the kinda guy that wants to be a soldier from some obscure corner of the war, like the Nachjagers, which is why I began researching Nazi Wunderwaffes, where the only reasonable thing to try to recreate was the Vampir unit (because as fun as it would be, I don' think a BB-emitting UFO is possible... yet)
PS: For anyone questioning that UFO bit, look up Die Glocke. Quite fascinating.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 18:19:02 GMT -5
Post by Garrick Udet on Jun 16, 2009 18:19:02 GMT -5
Good luck. Just remember guns are one-size fits all, uniforms are not. It is a lot easier for somebody like me to loan out a gun rather than a uniform.
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Vampir
Jun 16, 2009 19:35:03 GMT -5
Post by kilroy9thss on Jun 16, 2009 19:35:03 GMT -5
i like this its something u dont see alot of an if u do public events u get to teach the public about it which is awsome.. anyways u guys were talking about the battery pack.. looking at some pics it looks like a wood box with a german flame thrower metal frame which i would use an alice pack frame maybe cut it down
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Adler69
Master sergeant
Legio Patria Nostra
Posts: 2,859
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Vampir
Jun 17, 2009 1:09:00 GMT -5
Post by Adler69 on Jun 17, 2009 1:09:00 GMT -5
Or do what i do and mount a AN/PVS-2 Starlight Scope on your STG ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Vampir
Jun 17, 2009 9:28:46 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 17, 2009 9:28:46 GMT -5
As cool as that looks, I'd rather have a Vampir unit, but thank you for the idea
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Vampir
Jun 17, 2009 9:46:58 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 17, 2009 9:46:58 GMT -5
And sorry to double post, but for the box I think I'm going to just create one out of plywood, add the straps and little aesthetics, mount it on a metal frame, and then (if you hadn't geussed it), the smaller tube on the bottom is a Gas Mask Canister, which I will mount under it. Then from there I'm gonna attach some wiring (again, for the aesthetics). So my Vampir power-pack is set. Now, for the Vampir scope I don't know about the scope itself, becaue I think its a little shorter than a telescopic scope so I'll need some help in that area, and for the Infrared Spotlight I was thinking of buying in IR flashlight and encompassing it with a metal funnel with just the end sticking out so I can click on the flashlight. Now again, I've never worked with night vision before, so how would I cover the front? Would a transparent black/gray plastic 'lens' fit over the funnel affect the infrared at all? EDIT: Oh, just found these a few seconds after posting, I think it may work if I use the wood case for an M-44 Gas Mask as the battery box and as I said before I'll use a gas mask canister for the bottom. M-44 Mask & Case (1st Picture in the gallery): www.ima-usa.com/product_info.php/products_id/347
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Vampir
Jun 17, 2009 11:17:01 GMT -5
Post by gunfighters on Jun 17, 2009 11:17:01 GMT -5
"at long winter, there were numerous flares going up that would have rendered a night vision scope useless" a modern image intensifying tube, yes. not a vampir if you really want to "sim" one for feilf use i would gut one of these eyeclopsnightvision.com/about $60, active IR only alows you to see 50' with the built in IR sorce, but a bigger sorce would let you see father
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Vampir
Jun 17, 2009 11:25:09 GMT -5
Post by Meisterschutze on Jun 17, 2009 11:25:09 GMT -5
I think the "Vampir" syndrome comes from the new gun included on the new CoD:WaW map pack: An Wunderwaffer. I had my mates with stgs start going crazy wanting to make a Vampir out of a Acog...But after a few days, the syndrome suddenly dissapeared...
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Adler69
Master sergeant
Legio Patria Nostra
Posts: 2,859
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Vampir
Jun 17, 2009 11:37:25 GMT -5
Post by Adler69 on Jun 17, 2009 11:37:25 GMT -5
At the end of WWII , the US , British and Soviets got their hands on the VAMPIR scopes and they reversed engineered them The US came up with this copy Much closer to the VAMPIR than what the Soviets came up with I still have to find a photo of what the British came up with.
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Vampir
Jun 17, 2009 11:38:30 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 17, 2009 11:38:30 GMT -5
Haha, very quick with that. yes, after the new Map Pack came out, I heard of the new weapon, called the Wunderwaffe DG-2, and when I did research on it it turned up 'Wunderwaffe', which in turn led to my discovery of the ZG 1229 Vampir unit. Again, I do not mean to get defensive, but I do not have this 'syndrome', I simply want to 'airsoft-itize' a relatively unknown piece of history.
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Vampir
Jun 17, 2009 15:22:59 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 17, 2009 15:22:59 GMT -5
Now, to get back on track, I'm calling out to all you WWII buffs and custom gun builders out there, should I make the sight for the Vampir unit out of an original WWII Telescopic Sight or out of an ACOG sight?
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oberst42
Private
"Oh du Deutschland, ich muss marschieren!"
Posts: 387
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Vampir
Jun 18, 2009 1:13:09 GMT -5
Post by oberst42 on Jun 18, 2009 1:13:09 GMT -5
hmm... i'd go with the ACOG, as not to tear up an original scope
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Vampir
Jun 18, 2009 9:23:10 GMT -5
Post by nachtjager1945 on Jun 18, 2009 9:23:10 GMT -5
Alright, now can anyboidy tell just from eyeing it how much length I should add to it, or take away?
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