silencer
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Spartan by blood
Posts: 407
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Post by silencer on Mar 18, 2006 19:39:54 GMT -5
Did the axis powers use a shotgun? I know the allied had a mix of shotguns with a considerable amount of m1897's, and anyone who plays cod2 knows the axis also have the m1897. So my question is did the axis use a shotgun as well? Did they use the m1897?
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Post by mauser98k on Mar 18, 2006 20:46:52 GMT -5
I am almost dead sure that they didn't.
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Post by indy on Mar 18, 2006 21:15:39 GMT -5
No they did not. In fact the allies did not even use shotguns in the ETO...the Geneva conventioned banned them after WWI. You do see MPs using them though. Since Japan did not follow the Geneva convention, the US did use the shotgun in the PTO.
Cheers
Thomas
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silencer
Private 1st Class
Spartan by blood
Posts: 407
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Post by silencer on Mar 19, 2006 1:52:46 GMT -5
....So then why did cod2 give it the shotgun? Didn't germany not follow some of the geneva convention rules?
Thanks for the information guys.
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Post by indy on Mar 19, 2006 3:04:41 GMT -5
Don't take those games at face value. They use them for the same reason they use D-day assault vest in post-Normandy operations, same reason for many things....historical inaccuracies. One should try not to make assumptions from movies (yes even SPR and BOB) and games...they are incorrect a lot of the time. Hope this cleared it up.
Why did Germany not follow some of the other Geneva convention rules? Most did(you hear a lot about the ones who didn't)...the ones who didn't were tried for war crimes...ie SS at Malmedy, Einsaztgrupen (mobile killing squad), etc.
Cheers,
Thomas
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Post by mauser98k on Mar 19, 2006 3:08:47 GMT -5
Exactly, don't follow movies or games. Buy some props and see for yourself. I knew we didn't use shovel covers from 1976 during D-Day...Or did we?
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silencer
Private 1st Class
Spartan by blood
Posts: 407
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Post by silencer on Mar 19, 2006 3:28:21 GMT -5
Honestly, I don't (or try not to) take movies and video games for actual "face value". I was just wondering why cod2 decided to put the shot gun in. I guess for entertainment.
Also, more and more I hear how the german military was a mostly honorable and worthy oponent. However, since they started the whole taking over the world thing, they became bad guys.
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Post by Rainer Schmidt on Mar 19, 2006 5:25:44 GMT -5
Some of the rules in the Geneva convention are not followed for good reason, and that is because they are impractical. Take two very common modern tactics into account, Paratroops and Submarines: 1) Paratroops are not to be shot at until they are on the ground 2) Submarines have to declare their presence, board the ship for verification, allow the sailors to make it to safety, then sink the ship. Now I am no expert, and am recalling this at 2:20 in the morning, so I might be just a wee bit tired for this  |
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Post by smokeythebear on Mar 19, 2006 16:57:45 GMT -5
people just love the shotguns in games thats why its in cod2 ps who plays on xbox live/
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Post by mauser98k on Mar 19, 2006 17:00:22 GMT -5
Hello fellow sailor, may we sink your ship?
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Post by Reece on Mar 19, 2006 21:10:34 GMT -5
I think it was the Geneva that also says your not supposed to use the 50.cal on enemy personnel , only equipment(we'll just shoot at there canteens, helmets, and web gear)
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Post by mauser98k on Mar 19, 2006 21:19:04 GMT -5
Dont forget the uniforms!
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silencer
Private 1st Class
Spartan by blood
Posts: 407
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Post by silencer on Mar 19, 2006 21:32:14 GMT -5
I knew about the 50 cal rule, but I belive that was added in after ww2. Could be wrong.
Also, the sailers have to tell them they are going to sink them!?!?!?! That makes absolutly no sense. Then all the guys on the ship except a few of them could be sleeping all the time because there would always be a warning.
Paratroops not getting shot untill they hit the ground?!!!! That is like telling soldiers they have to say hi before they can shoot!
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Post by TS Allen on Mar 19, 2006 22:41:58 GMT -5
If you want to use a shotgun, just do North Africa. The British DID use a shotgun in there stations in Africa. If any of you have fired a Henry Martini you know exactly what people consider to be necessary to "Pot the fellow, somebody." The Germans used quite literally TONS of captured British Uniforms, guns, ammunition, fuel, whenever they captured. The Afrika Koprs in total captured like 90 tonnes of just British Tropical Pants during the War. My Afrika Korps officer who has just been schocked by heat and the fact he would only wear feldgrau upon coming here impression is currently coming along nicely, and getting myself a Civilian Gun, Hunting Rifle, or Shotgun would be impressive.
TS Allen
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Post by Rainer Schmidt on Mar 20, 2006 2:08:26 GMT -5
Btw, some of the rules, upon a further look into, could be part of other treaties too, like the Hague, but I'm not 100% on any of that, just what I can retain from reading. Brain is filling up :S
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Post by Tech on Mar 20, 2006 21:40:12 GMT -5
They did in fact use Shotguns in the ETO and the PTO, They were primarily used by Military Police. I've got plenty of books with pictures of Military Police using the Model 1897 Trench Shotgun. The Geneve Convention never banned shotguns. the Germans in WW1 tried to appeal to the Geneva convention to get them to ban them in combat, but the allies said the germans should have to ban gas attacks if they wanted the allies to stop using shotguns. In terms of not being able to shoot paratroopers. You cannt shoot Downed Pilots that is against the Geneva Convention. Paratroopers are fair game.
Off me Soap Box
Alex
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Post by Jager.Drü on May 29, 2006 2:42:06 GMT -5
You can shoot at paratroops if they shoot first from the air.
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