S&.T M1903 Springfield

[2nd Bat]

I and several of our forum members recently purchased this new offering from S&T which is a very attractive airsoft replica of the US Rifle 30 Cal. M1903 bolt action rifle. Unlike earlier releases of assorted WW2 bolt action rifles which are gas powered or eject shells this one is a traditional spring powered rifle that promises to be more skirmishable. This one features a real wood stock and all metal Construction. It loads a 23 round magazine underneath via a unique magazine that insert after routing it through a trap door hidden in the guns base plate. The rifle is gorgeous visually and nicely balanced its slightly lighter than an actual Springfield and is a one to one replica. The cocking action is reasonable once you're used to it and it shoots .20 gram BBs at just shy of 400 FPS although other owners report velocities both higher and lower. The hop up is marginal as it comes. Neither horrible or great. It was originally available at $150.00 but seems to be settling at around $200.00. In my opinion it represents a great value and is a great new addition to the recent spate of new WW2 rifles. Let's hope a Kar98, SMLE and Arisaka soon follow.

[Jerry-ADK]

Hmmmm. How about mating this with a D boys K98 to get a skirmishable German weapon? I know this may sound like sacrelidge but with buying a bar 10 plus upgrades you can easily spend over $200.

[2nd Bat]

The pity of it is that it's a really nice replica and it would be a waste of the nice stock and excellent trim bits. It doesn't really shoot any better than a BAR 10 so I think the only upside would be the hidden lower magazine feed system. I have to believe S&T has a Kar 98 in the wings set up to use these same internals. I hope so anyway!!!

[Dracul]

Prepare for a long post here. Really detailed review. It might even should be in the Technical section.

Flat out. This is NOT a VSR-10 clone!

First off. These were my intended upgrade parts: PPS/SHS cylinder upgrade kit, Clandestine (PPS/SHS) trigger and piston, JG OEM BAR-10 hop up chamber, and (not pictured) Nineball bucking.



General disassembly, is pretty straight forward. Just be careful of the under-stock metal pieces, and be wary of the two rear stock screws, for they are lies. They screw in and out, but they hold anything. Also, the forward “screw” on the trigger guard assembly is also a lie.



First mod to do, is to remove the trap door for better mag access. I wouldn't have a problem with this, if it worked right and didn't dangle and make noise when its open. It just doesn't slam shut easily. You have to try to line it up, push in the release button, and jiggle it until it seats. Can't be messing with that door in the middle of battle. Its held in by a simple pin, just knock it out, I had to hammer it out, it was pretty damn snug in there.



The outer barrel is in two sections. The first section (which I'll get to later) holds the hopup in place, and second section is the 1903 stuff. It easily screws in and out here, but it doesn't lock into place with the sights aligned, so you can't screw it in all the way.



Here is the trigger box. This is where the rabbit hole opens... It looks fairly standard, and its not bad. The front screw is now the trigger sear pin, there is a spacer of some sort, and the safety is now internal and works with the flip 1903 safety. Top one is a VSR clone, bottom is 1903.



Left one is 1903.



Going head first into this rabbit hole. The PPS/SHS sears fit in no problem. HOWEVER, disaster struck during reassembly. I eventually found out that the 1903 sears are a tad smaller. The PPS/SHS sears would not let the cylinder go in. Granted, one can always place in the cylinder first and then mount the trigger box, but I'll get to that later....



The 1903 cylinder.



The underside of the 1903 cylinder. You can see that standard yellow plastic cylinder internals in most VSR-10 clones.



Close up on the fancy safety mechanism.



And the rabbit hole continues deeper. The cylinder internals are smaller. And, this is where I believe my "not as advertised FPS" of 350 comes from. No O-ring on cylinder. 



Especially the diameter. Now an earthquake hit the rabbit hole... The 1903 cylinder is smaller than the VSR-10 cylinder! The upgrade parts are too big! I even did a sanity check and compared the sizes with TM OEM parts, and still smaller.



The first section of the outer barrel is mounted via these two small screws, one on each side. Note two things. The hand guard hardware free-floats and is not mounted, and the front cylinder guide might fall out when pulling out the outer barrel.



So, the hopup chamber is smaller as well. HOWEVER, they redeemed themselves by doing good with this. While the inner barrel and bucking is not VSR-10 spec, it is AEG spec! I wasn't expecting this, but this means upgrading these parts should be easier to do. Not too bad.



Also, be careful of moving the stock while the gun is disassembled. The stock is split, and nothing retains it until all the other parts are put together.



Soooo, kind of disappointed in this. Its not terrible, but the cylinder situation is pretty bad. Puts a damper on the longevity of the 1903 and my plan to turn this into an accurate and far reaching rifle. These plastic internals are going to eventually die, and there aren't replacements. There MIGHT be other bolt actions that share the same dimensions, but I can't confirm that. I actually checked the size of the cylinder to an AGM MP001, turns out the 1903's cylinder is bigger.

This weekend sometime, I'll be heading to East Coast Airsoft in Maryland to see if they have any sort of bolt action parts that might work with this. If not, I know a guy who makes custom pistons for other bolt actions. Might be pricey, but its something.

Its a damned good replica, and I hate it to suffer because of this. At least its not like the AGM MP001 or the AGM L96 with real sheisty hopup chamber and bucking systems....


UPDATE: Just came back from East Coast Airsoft, and no luck with finding parts. Looks like I'm going the "I know a guy" option here. 

[droopaille]

Good job
but it is missing 6 pics
3 after "The underside of the 1903 cylinder..."
3 after "The first section of the outer barrel is mounted..."

[2nd Bat]

Super helpful Dracul. What this suggests is until upgrade parts come out specific for this rifle (which will probably NOT happen until a lot of them are in circulation) we will have to get by with slightly adapted stock parts. You mentioned the lack of an "o" ring and upgrades to the AEG type hopup (which I find highly encouraging). How weird that standard VSR internals weren't used but probably they wouldn't fit the size restraints if the bolt and reciver area were to remain accurate.

Thankfully you have numerous VSR projects and builds so your investment in upgraded parts will no doubt find a suitable home.

[Dracul]

Droopaille: Refresh the page maybe? I see all of them right now, but I did have to re-add some of the pics after the initial post. Maybe Pro-Boards or Imgur acting screwy?

2ndBat: Indeed. I'll let everyone here know about the custom made piston and spring guides turns out. AEG barrel and bucking was really golden of them and definitely shows that they learned a lot from AGM's crappy bolt actions. The dimensions would be my only guess as to why it was built like this. I wouldn't imagine anyone complaining about a few mm bigger here and there if it meant having upgrade and repair parts plentiful. Maybe S&T was afraid of a backlash for not having the 1903 1:1 scale?

Oh, I have no worries about these upgrade parts not finding homes, not with more projects on the horizon.

[droopaille]

That's strange, it works now

[2nd Bat]

I am anxious to get home to see if the "o" ring is absent on my S&T? Anyone else check on theirs? That would be a super easy fix generating no doubt an immediate improvement in FPS with no increase in cocking effort or durability.

[volkssturm]

Sounds like someone needs to talk to Quality Control about those O-rings.

[Dracul]

Been talking with the guy. He goes by "Ranger" on the Airsoft Sniper Forums. He makes custom cylinder internals. He is down for making 1903 cylinder internals. He just needs an original, so I'll be shipping out my entire 1903 cylinder to him tomorrow! Will keep everyone updated.

[2nd Bat]

Wow! Dracul, you are the man! If this works out you are going to be put in for a metal! I love the rifle but if I could get another 100 fps out of it without paying the moon I would love it even more!

[Dracul]

Small update.

My guy will be receiving the cylinder tomorrow, and from then should be able to work on it and hopefully get it finished in the week.

He is going to be playing around with different style springs to see what will work with it. Ideally, I hope a standard VSR-10 spring will work with it. If not, I don't think its going to be that big of a deal. Between a new, double o-ring slotted piston, AEG buckings and barrels (maple leaf 75 degree bucking and a 6.03 tbb), and DYI mods (like barrel stabilization). I think it will become a damn good shooter on its own, even if it is only getting (complete estimate) 415-420 fps.

[stuka]

in my opinion, using a boltie as a main rifle (not as a sniper) it doesn't need to be more then 400fps to comply with most rules regarding outdoor play

[Dracul]

No it doesn't, and for most applications, I'd agree. Especially if its going to be a loaner weapon. But my intent is to make this accurate as all hell and carry a sidearm. IE, its going to be my main US rifle for WWII.

[Dracul]

So, guy got it in, and this is what he has to say right off the bat:

"I love the cylinder man, thats very nice looking. The piston does look propriatary. Its vsr length, but aps2 in diameter. Uses a plunger cup, but has a slot for an o ring but there wasnt one installed lol. Very strange piston. The spring hole is vsr, but the spring seems a bit shorter. The spring guide is vsr, but slightly different looking."

So, cutting down a VSR spring should work, but trying to calculate the FPS of that without actually doing it is impossible.

[2nd Bat]

So a shortened VSR spring and added O ring along with other logical teflon tape applications and some additional internal barrel stays sounds like some worthwhile enhancements. When I am home from this trip I will definitely look into the O ring issue as that impact should be fairly significant and its super simple. Because a boltie needs to be somewhat standoff (not as significant when most players are semi auto) and needs to be as accurate as an airsoft rifle can be AND hard hitting at range, FPS higher than 425 is essential. If I can achieve between 425 and 500 FPS I will be thrilled with this rifle. As it is I am very very pleased.

[Dracul]

Those, and the barrel/bucking, seem like the only upgrades that one can do with parts and supplies on the market.

On the note of shortening springs. Since cutting down a spring will obviously cause FPS drop, it would be wise to get a spring that, under normal VSR circumstances, would give you a fps far higher than what you want. Again, I don't have an equation of how fps is lost per coils cut per different rated springs.

Now, I'm willing to be the one who figures this out. Probably have to go through a lot of trial and error, and wasted springs, but as long I can make it at least 450fps, I'll be very happy. Especially since I'm going to be the only guy with a good metal piston that can work with higher rated springs. I'm afraid, even with cutting springs, if you got too high, you will kill the plastic piston in a few shots, or just not work at all.

[shiftysgarand]

www.airsoftsniperforum.com/32-general-sniper-talk/12579-choosing-right-spring-making-work.html
This should help reduce the trial and error. I would guess to get 450~ish fps you'd want to get an M160 spring, let it break in (perhaps in a different gun) then cut off a coil. Of course, I don't know how many coils have to be cut for the spring to fit, so you may have to use a stiffer one and cut more coils.

[2nd Bat]

Wow. I just read through all of his posts and now my head hurts. Some very worthwhile information. Thanks for the links.

[Dracul]

I, too, have read this, but this isn't just cutting a few coils off here and there to get the "just right FPS". We are talking full centimeters and/or inches off to get the proper length to make it work and see if the work doing it worthwhile (IE getting more FPS than the stock spring). So, I'm going to go bold the spring strength. I'm going to start off with a M190! I plan on getting other springs, mainly M170 and M150, doing the same to those, just to get some sort of VSR-1903 Converted Spring Strength Chart, for others to see and choose whats right.

What I'm afraid of, is that cutting a M150, or even M170, down the 1903 length, that I won't gain enough FPS or maybe even lose FPS.

Buuuuut this is why we test things and then document the results. Something something science, blah blah technobabble.

[stuka]

I just hope your sears can handle it

[Dracul]

The trigger box can accept the PPS/SHS sears. However, due to the dimensions, you have to put the trigger box on AFTER the cylinder is in.

What is also good, is that the PPS/SHS sears are the sears that this guy prefers, and makes his stuff to that spec.

[Dracul]

So, awesome update here! 

My guy got the piston and spring guide finished! Shipping out tomorrow! Here are a few pics. 

New fancy piston on bottom, and stock on top. This was the most upgraded type he offered. All the bells and whistles possible. I sprung for it, but it isn't necessary to make this shoot good. Double O-ring for best air seal and drilled out holes to make piston lighter and travel a bit faster.



Piston with the spring guide:



Can't wait until I get this in! I also have a 6.03 Prometheus tightbore barrel, Maple Leaf 75 degree bucking, and some real high powered springs on the way in as well. 


I'm having a really good feeling about all of this, hehehehe. 

[2nd Bat]

All of us with S&T Springfield's await your scientific results. If possible I'd love to hear what each component contributes although I know that will be a lot more work.

For example what the custom piston with its o rings does with the standard spring and the effect of the new barrel and hop up?

[Dracul]

With the piston, both of it's added features are designed to increase FPS, even if its only a little bit. Obviously the double O-ring creates a better air seal, pushing maximum air into the inner barrel. The "Swiss cheese" part of it is, upon release from the piston sear, travel faster, resulting in air pushed out faster, increasing the FPS.

How much FPS are those two things supposed to increase? I'm actually not sure, but we will see! When I get the parts in, I'm going to chrono the 1903 with just the new cylinder internals in it, just to see how well it upgrades it over all. Then, I will go ahead and install the better inner barrel, bucking, and play with spring sizes.

[2nd Bat]

Perfect!

[Dracul]

My guy shipped it yesterday! I should be getting it in tomorrow!!

[Dracul]

Alright, so I got the all the items I wanted in yesterday! The new cylinder internals, inner barrel, buckings and a M190 and M150 spring. As soon as I got home I got to work on it. I split this in a few parts. A lot to explain and I'll upload pics once everything is said and done... As I still have to work on one thing. 


New piston and spring guide: 

Ranger's piston and spring guide worked perfectly! However, I was still getting my stock FPS of about 350 w/ .20's. Unsure if it was because of the 1903's hopup degrading or the double O-ring piston thing was mumbo jumbo, but I'm going to blame this on the hopup (I'll explain later). For now though, even if the piston does not increase FPS, I can tell you the structural integrity is indeed there and will last you forever! 

Replacing the inner barrel and bucking:

This is where I lost most of Thursday night. Not sure how to feel about this just yet, I guess time will tell.... Alright, so I got 6.03 Prometheus tightbore barrel and a Maple Leaf 75 degree bucking. First problem I found was that the AEG bucking needed to be cut down to fit in the chamber. No problem, I cut down the top portion of the Maple Leaf bucking and things fit. When I go to fire, I was shooting at under 250fps and was getting double feeds! I thought it was the barrel at first, so I swap it out for a 6.02 PPS tightbore with the same bucking. Shot the same results. Then, realizing I had similar issues with the Maple Leaf bucking in another non-standard hopup chamber, I swap it out for a cut down stock bucking from another AEG of mine. Same exact issues. I go ahead and put in the original 1903 bucking and boom, FPS rises to what I got before and no more double feeding. I can only assume that this bucking is proprietary. I wish I can say that the 1903 uses the same bucking as another non-standard hopup, but I don't have every type of bucking that existed in front of me. Wasted two good buckings.... Even if one was just a stock one, I'm not pleased.... The good thing is, wrapping electrical tape does help stabilize the barrel inside the outer barrel. Personally, I think the quality control is complete ass, and if your 1903 isn't shooting at 400fps (after a good cleaning), you got a bad bucking and doing the that screw-in-handguard mod that one of our French members did (sorry, forgetting his username at the moment) is probably going to be mandatory! 

Cutting springs:

This is where I stopped for the night and won't continue on it for a few days. I cut the M190 spring down to the 1903's spring size, popped it in, and I couldn't pull it back far enough to cock properly. I tried with all my might and I was getting the feeling it wasn't healthy for the bolt handle. At this point it was late and because of the hand strength needed to cut the spring, stuff in all the cylinder internals into the cylinder, and attempting to cock it, my hand was hurting the surgery area, and became afraid of it opening it back up. I was going to mess around with the M150 spring today, but that area was hurting all day. Nothing terrible at all, maybe 1 or 2 out of 10, with 10 being near death, but enough to make me want to take a few steps back.


It pains me to say this, since I know everyone is anxious to see the results, but I'm going to wait until next weekend to continue working on this. The sooner I get healed up to 100%, the sooner I can work on this and test fire it without worries of putting up with the Army Medical System ever again.... Once everything is done, I'm going to condense all my posts about the 1903 and create one single entity and put it up on my new blog. 

Until then, I got plenty of sewing to catch up on! 

[2nd Bat]

Your efforts though not yet complete are much appreciated. Thanks for the update.