Luftwaffe field uniform and gear questions?

[Dracul]

So, when I was at Joann Fabrics last, I found one wool section where the wool they had were made up of 80% rayon and 20% wool. Which, according to this article here, www.dererstezug.com/germanwoolfabric.htm , it says, "the composition ultimately reached 15% wool to 85% viscose rayon/recycled fiber on fabric made after 1942." What Joann's have here isn't too far off. The material itself seemed strong enough and felt close to the German wool items I have, I was pulling at it pretty hard to see if it would rip or anything, and no ripping. Price was really good at $10 a yard. 

Problem was, is that the colors were pretty basic, and two shades of grey were too far off from Field Grey (and I don't think it would dye well because of the all of the rayon). However, one of the blues they had were a darker blue. Not the LW Blue-Grey, but I think it COULD be passable. 

So, my questions are, if I were to create some LW tunics, M43 field caps, and trousers:

-What would be the most common type of LW ground unit that would be in a line combat role (I'll be staying away from FJ, only because of their distinct and special gear)?

-What tunic would be more prevalent in that type of unit: M40 Fliegerbluse or a M35 "Tuchrock" tunic? Personally, the M35 would be easier for me to make. Since I'd have to draft a new pattern for the M40's. 

-Would this type of unit use FJ gear (like the FJ bandoleer suspenders) or the WH type gear (just brown instead of black)? 

Thank you. 

[aldrich]

The most common combat unit would have been the luftwaffe field divisions  (LFD's). These were surplus ground crews pressed into service as infantry. Since Goering didn't want to give up troops to be integrated into the army, he created his own units with their own uniforms. These did poorly in combat and were eventually taken over by the army, although they retained their status as LFD's and were independent units. By 1944, they would have had a mixture of gear from both the luftwaffe, as well as gear/uniforms from the heer when luftwaffe stocks ran low. Typically in Normandy they had mostly luftwaffe stuff still since they weren't doing too much to wear them out until D-day. Here is an example of a LFD soldier in full luftwaffe gear:



Uniform wise, the m35 would not have been used. Your best bet would be to do feldblau m40-43 pants and the feldbluse. Other options for tunics for 1944-45 include a m42-43 heer tunic with a luftwaffe breast eagle and no collar tabs. Since LFD's had good connections through Goering, they had plenty of access to camo. On one hand, they had special smocks made for them in splinter B pattern and Tan and Water pattern, I have also seen pictures of them wearing heer tan and water smocks, splinter helmet covers, and zeltbahns. The LFD's were like the SS in that camo would have been the norm.

[Dracul]

A lot of good info there, thanks!

Hmm... Camo is the norm here. I actually did just get in a Tan and Water smock in today that I got a good deal on, while it will be easy to replicate, I'll have to custom order the material, and that won't be cheap either... Ideally, I'll probably just start out with the basic wools and get to the smocks another time.

Luckily, since they did use some Heer gear, some of those items are the norm of my loaner kits anyway. Belts, helms w/ splinter covers, brown pouches, etc. Making bread bags and gamaschen in blue canvas and fake brown leather won't be hard at all, either. So, this will help.

I'll have to get a M40 Fliegerbuse to use as a model now.

[2nd Bat]

You're right to assume a dye won't take with that much rayon. My only luck with dying anything has been with either cotton or wool and then only able to create a subtle change. Once complete the dyes are quickly impacted by the fading of field exposure. Much more so than factory dyes. I dyed aa bunch of tan french uniform shirts using a Reed green olive blend to create uniforms more appropriate for post 1964 north Vietnamese shirts. They came out great but faded very non uniformly which in fact was quite authentic. Anything I dyed with polyester did not afford a good effect.

[aldrich]

I would, personally, skip the fliegerbluse and invest in smocks. There are some relatively affordable LFD smock reproductions floating around. The smock will completely cover them anyways.

[Dracul]

Understood. I could still use the wool for the pants. $20-$30 for trousers isn't bad at all. I would have to get the patterns printed on fabric for smocks.

Then which would be more common for LFD: Tan and Water or Splinter B?

[aldrich]

For the smocks made for the luftwaffe field divisions, splinter B was much more common. I also made a mistake when I said tan and water heer smocks. Turns out they were actually photos of the Herman Goering division, not a LFD. Here is a good site I stumbled upon breaking down the uniform:

www.reenactor.net/units/zzz12317lwfd/4-uniforms.html

[Dracul]

They had a camo jacket, as well apparently. I'll have to look more into that. Or is that the specialized smock you were talking about and in that picture?

[aldrich]

Yep, that's what I was talking about. I wouldn't really call it a jacket as it is about as thick as a zelt.

[Dracul]

Fair enough, but the link you posted called it a jacket and combat jackets post WWII, up until 2000 about, were all rather heavy and big (think M65). Oh well. I'll probably just stick with the standard style smocks, just in Splinter B.

[aldrich]

Yeah, I just pointed that out because many people think they were just winter jackets due to the name, but in reality they were worn year round and are not too thick at all. As for smocks, the standard ones never came in splinter B, just A. I would stick to the iconic LFD jacket. Based on mine, It would actually be easier to make than the army smock due to the lack of drawstrings. The hard part is getting fabric.  It is almost similar to the drillich albeit larger, different pockets, and snap buttons at the wrist:

[Dracul]

Nah, when I hear "combat jacket," the US M65 combat jacket always comes to mind. I know the fine line between winter and combat jackets, haha.

In all honesty, both of them have their hard and easy parts about making them.

All the smock pieces are pretty square and straight, not a lot of curves or skirting out like the tunics. Which is easy in my book, but my concern would be making the chest/pocket holes.

The jacket here looks more like a modern day jacket. Not as curvy as the standard tunics, and the cuffs look like modern BDU cuffs. Rather, it looks like a more simplified tunic, however I never really made pockets that open on the outside where the pocket is internal. So, there is my concern about that.

Regardless of pattern, I'd have to get the fabric made from Spoonflower. Looks like the best military uniform fabric they offer is cotton poplin. Which would be $20 a yard.

With all this said, after I my personal kit (which I have something finally posted in the working on it thread) and my WH loaner kits where I want them, I'll grab one of the LFD Jackets and order some swatches and go from there.

A lot of good info here, opens up more possibilities for kits and scenarios. 

[2nd Bat]

Luffwaffe units are popular with reenacting units as they had elite status without the negative stigma of the SS. They also had a lot of specialized gear and uniform bits. The simple round pot helmet and jump smock for the paratroopers are probably the most iconic items. The jump smock had no external buttons and the helmet was designed to reduce anything likely to snag on shroud lines during jumps.

[Dracul]

Except these are just ground guys. I wish there was an easy way to do FJ the same way I'm handling WH, but its just not possible. I would love to put together FJ kits for that reason. These ground guys, while being more expensive then the WH kits, it won't be too much more. Since they share a lot of the same gear.

[Dracul]

Soooo, a bit of an update on this project. I decided to go and use the same aforementioned wool felt material for my costuming hobby, and while I really like working with it, it turned out to be not as strong as I would have liked. It was used for a coat, and just wearing it 4 times, the material started to thin out under the sleeves and where it lined up with the bottom of an inner pocket. None of this was under the harshness we put garments through, and it was just under normal, convention conditions that caused this thinning out.

With that said, I completely feel that the wool felt material from Joann's is very much unsuitable for our purposes. I'm still going to use it for mock M36 collars and to make shoulderboards, but it is unsuitable as a main material for tunics and pants.

Through searching elsewhere, I did find a 100% wool dealer on eBay, that claims their wool line is tough and durable, and with a $17 per yard price tag. Only blue they offer is a royal blue, so that destroys this specific project idea, however, their grey looks pretty close to the E. German uniform grey. In the near future, I'm going to order a few yards and see what I can do with it. If the grey is at least the E. German grey, I'll find it acceptable. Each tunic would cost a bit more than HBT and Drillich ones, and not nearly as much as proper field grey wool, but if it works, I can start making wool tunics if I need to at only a small bump up in price (maybe even some trousers).

When I do, I'll probably start a different thread about it.

UPDATE: Just had an idea that I could use the grey wool for field caps, if I could source the buttons cheap enough. Since these guys don't send swatches, I can just get a test yard and use them for some caps, and if the wool isn't up to at least Loaner/E. German standard and shade, I'm sure I can trade them away to 2nd Bat, haha. 

[2nd Bat]

My middle daughter is a fashion designer and creates and sells woman's fashion items (Tuesdays Scarves). She is currently into creative fabric dying producing fabulous results. I watched her as she went about her work and was surprised to learn that some of here Kimono like garments were Rayon. According to her Rayon is a plant based material (as is cotton of course) and takes and holds a dye just fine. I always thought Rayon was a synthetic, oil based fabric.

I am hoping as her efforts shift to other endeavors within her business that I can take advantage of her dying set up for my own purposes. Incidentally if you are ever looking for a fabulous gift for mom or your wife or girlfriend Google Tuesdays Scarves and see what catches your eye. She ships all over the world.

[Dracul]

In all honesty, I'm kind of worried about their claim about complete wool, or rather, the lack of data about the make up of it. Wool for $17/yd is enticing, but who knows what substitutes are in there to make it cheaper and if it could even hold a dye because of it. Either way, if it matches at least E. German grey wool, I'll be more than happy.

[volkssturm]

Interesting. For some reason I was thinking rayon was a synthetic using a coal byproduct as feedstock. I looked it up on the all-knowing Internet. Rayon is made from cellulose. Learning something everyday. Mostly how little I know.

[2nd Bat]

I bought some of the Joanne fabic that I thought looked like grey wool and used some to create lower pockets on my home tweaked tunics and scarf/ head wraps for my Kraut set ups.