|
|
Post by mentara on Apr 5, 2008 12:19:31 GMT -5
I added a wooden extended charging handle and wooden spade grips. I don't know about the historical correctness, but it sure looks sweet this way!  Wooden pieces made out of an old broomstick!  |
|
|
|
Post by mischief on Apr 5, 2008 16:18:32 GMT -5
You know, sometimes the cool factor should outweigh the historical factor.
|
|
biged
Master sergeant 
Posts: 468
|
Post by biged on Apr 6, 2008 4:43:17 GMT -5
I don't think it cool, it looks, wrong.
Point's given to the "Pistol Grip versus the Double Grip" in the Butler Report by Ordnance Captain John S. Butler published April 21, 1919.
a. Ease of Manufacture.
b. Greater ease of firing with one hand leaving the other free to operate the elevating and traversing mechanism, and for tapping traverse.
c. The ease with which a shoulder rest or butt stock could be applied to the pistol grip for use with anti-aircraft or tank mounts.
d. The pistol grip presented less opportunity to disturb the proper laying of the gun than did the double grip.
e. The control of machine gun fire from tripods by means of grips has gradually been replaced by a more positive mechanical control with the tripod itself.
Spade grip manufacture was dropped for the millions of infantry Browning 1919a4's used in ww2.
///ed///
|
|
YankeeDiv26
Staff Sgt.
Frustrated Mac Owner
BDM<33
Posts: 2,462
|
Post by YankeeDiv26 on Apr 6, 2008 8:26:33 GMT -5
He's got a pistol grip he can pop on as well.
|
|
|
|
Post by mentara on Apr 6, 2008 12:23:40 GMT -5
He's got a pistol grip he can pop on as well. True, that's what I use for 'Nam themed events. But when it's nothing specific, the spade grips go on! |
|
|
|
Post by m5a11943 on Apr 7, 2008 12:01:07 GMT -5
Hey mentara I liked what you did and historic is always WAY better than cool. Actually when one does it historically it is cool.
I'm picking up the M1917 and I hope you don't mind if I use your idea. It's great for early stuff WWI and the Marines at the Canal.
|
|
biged
Master sergeant
Posts: 468
|
Post by biged on Apr 8, 2008 4:38:59 GMT -5
The Vicker's machine gun had spade grips. Ground 1917's, 1917a1's and 1919a4's did not.
The only brownings (Many manufactured by Colt) that had spade grips were the M38B Anti-aircraft water cooled 1919's placed on the M37 tripod. The "B" designated the spade grips. The M38BT was a short barreled tank gun.
The Springfield Armory's T3E3, which had 3 grip systems and a very heavy barrel. Finally the MG40 later re designated the ANM2.
Basically anti-aircraft guns had spade grips. Anti-aircraft guns were ALWAYS mounted on specialized tripods.
How rare are spade grips on ground guns?
Letter from the National Archives from Springfield Armory addressed to Colt's Patent Fire Arms Manufacturing Co. dated April 23, 1919.
With further reference to instructions from Colonel McFarland, May 2, 1918 under which you produced 13 double grip handle blocks for the Browning machine gun. Model 1917, at a cost of $2,548.00. Please be advised that this office is unable to take effective action towards procuring the issue of a Procurement Order to cover this work.
///ed///
|
|
|
|
Post by mentara on Apr 8, 2008 18:08:24 GMT -5
I know that historically the spade grips mean jack sh*t for the M1919A4. But they just look much cooler for regular non-themed airsoft events. It was also to share my "idea" of using a stupid broomstick and some wood paint to change the plastic grips into wood at super low cost. I took me like half an hour or something. The little wooden piece I use for charging handle extension is actually taken from a little bucket for flowers and decoration. Like the one in this pic:  Fits perfectly! ;D |
|
biged
Master sergeant
Posts: 468
|
Post by biged on Apr 9, 2008 5:36:13 GMT -5
Nice mod. The experimental grips were wood and later changed to bakelite just like the Vicker's.
There was never a wood charging handle on any Browning .30 cal.
I used maple wood grips and charging handle on my custom M2HB Vortex. Historically incorrect because just before the war began they too were switched over to bakelite.
///ed///
|
|
|
|
Post by m5a11943 on Apr 9, 2008 12:16:05 GMT -5
mentara if you are a student of history like I am.
You know that once in the field the manual was thrown out.
Guys did whatever they wanted to make things better and that
has never changed. GI's were inventors and that goes back to
the very beginning of our country.
When I was in the Nam we changed alot of stuff and some of that
came from what was done in WWII.
You just keep on doing the great things you are doing.
That charging handle is a very good idea and I can see us doing
that. If someone tells you that it is not by the book, laugh we are.
|
|
biged
Master sergeant
Posts: 468
|
Post by biged on Apr 10, 2008 5:36:57 GMT -5
I can see the use of spade grips. But the charging handle? Aside from the aesthetic look, there are no benefits to doing it.  It's solid steel, seated to the bolt, charging handle. It moves with the bolt when each shot is fired. I had to thread my charging handle with a 3/8ths die in order to keep it fastened to the demilled right side plate. Normally it is seated onto the bolt and gets removed when the back plate is removed to adjust the head space. I also drilled a hole through the center of it to add a safety switch. Both tasks were difficult because of the hardened steel of the charging handle. ///ed/// |
|
|
|
Post by mentara on Apr 10, 2008 15:43:30 GMT -5
Aside from the aesthetic look,... BINGO...  |
|
|
|
Post by schmitty on Apr 11, 2008 11:37:18 GMT -5
Although I think you did a nice job including clever use of cheap materials, and although many would agree the spade grips look better than that goofy pistol grip and awkward trigger on the M1919. This is the WW2AA. Most of us are trying hard to make things look more WWII correct not less. Therefore maybe this isn't the right forum to post how to make your stuff look less accurate?
Schmitty
|
|
|
|
Post by mentara on Apr 11, 2008 15:04:59 GMT -5
Yea, you're probably right, Schmitty. But still, you could consider it a "suggestion" on how you could create certain things without a lot of talent, patience, and budget. But I'll keep your advice in mind for future posts though! By the way: the internals of this beauty were pretty messed up because of the rough handling during shipping. And pretty much all the wires came loose from the gearbox. And since I'm not much of a technician, I was wondering if anyone could help me out with a picture of how the wires are attached to the gearbox? That way I can try and fix it myself. Since Ian "Killbucket" can't help me out on this issue. THANKS IN ADVANCE!  |
|
2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
|
Post by 2nd Bat on Apr 11, 2008 16:28:06 GMT -5
Mentara,
Killbucket has always been very supportive in my experience. Perhaps if you posted some pictures of what was messed up we could help. The actual bolt from a surplus 30 Cal is not a terribly expensive or difficult item to get by the way. $7.00 or so as I recall?
|
|
|
|
Post by mentara on Apr 13, 2008 7:18:15 GMT -5
Perhaps if you posted some pictures of what was messed up we could help. Yea, I'll be at home on tuesday evening, I'll post some pics with the currect state of the gearbox than. You had 2 of those Airsharp's, right? Or am I confusing you with someone else now? Yea, I should see for a real deal charging handle. But M1919parts in general are more easily (and cheaper) found in the US then in Europe I think. An extended charging handle easily sells for 10-15 Euros. (that's like 15-20 USD) |
|
|
|
Post by m5a11943 on May 9, 2008 11:50:23 GMT -5
Mentara how long did it take for you to receive your MG after you ordered it. I just ordered mine and I would like to know how long a wait there is. In the mean time I will be collecting what I need to do the same things you did to yours.
|
|
|
|
Post by mentara on May 19, 2008 16:19:16 GMT -5
Mentara how long did it take for you to receive your MG after you ordered it. I just ordered mine and I would like to know how long a wait there is. In the mean time I will be collecting what I need to do the same things you did to yours. Sorry for the late respons, but I bought mine 2nd hand from Yankeediv from the forum here. All in all i think the shipping took about 2 weeks If i recall correctly. And all I had to pay extra was 10 Euros for import, so that's a steal! |
|
|
|
Post by killbucket on Jun 15, 2008 14:50:11 GMT -5
As usual, I'm up to my ears in work. Here's the basic wiring diagram:  The part number on the relay will vary. |
|
