2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Sept 2, 2009 17:57:27 GMT -5
I still continue to build them but at a reduced pace. It was simply taking all my spare time and with work and events all over the country there was precious little available. I have another batch in progress and have some sold orders to fill and currently have a couple in the hopper unsold which should be ready in 10 days or so. I just shipped out 2 today and have two more going out by Friday.
I considered doing all polyply guns which once a mold was made would reduce the individual production costs substantially and speed up the build time but I'm not sure if the somewhat reduced price would significantly boost the market volume. A long rifle that fires 12 shots and needs to reload is pretty much limited to our niche and even if I could bring down the sales price to below $400.00 I just don't think it would change things much. It would still be expensive compared to most quality AEG rifles which sell for around $150.00!
If enough people feel otherwise it might be worth investing quite a bit of money and time in the tooling molds and set up.
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CptJericho
Private 1st Class
"We got to stop the Germans from getting the secret weapons!"
Posts: 495
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Post by CptJericho on Sept 5, 2009 17:45:47 GMT -5
I would buy one of yours but im a little strapped for cash. so im just going to convert an m14, and shop on ebay to get the best price. cant afford to pay for labor.
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Post by m5a11943 on Sept 10, 2009 7:46:52 GMT -5
That's silly!!! If you have the money to buy an M14 how much more would you need to get one of 2ndBatts Garands. Now he is working with you to get it in your hands for less. By the time you try to convert one yourself you could have saved enough to get one of his, both in time and money. Stop and think about it. This is advice from an old hand.
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Sgt_Tom
Technical Sgt.
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Sept 10, 2009 8:13:03 GMT -5
m5a11943 is probably right but if your a young teenager like I am, labor and time usually isn't a big problem as we have a lot of free time on our hands. CptJericho any conversion is challenging for the first time. I have had my share of problems. I don't know why but I have had horrible luck with the M14. However I am not going to say M14's are a bad gun as I know many many people who have very little to no problems with them. If you need any help feel free to PM me.
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CptJericho
Private 1st Class
"We got to stop the Germans from getting the secret weapons!"
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Post by CptJericho on Sept 10, 2009 14:58:15 GMT -5
well ive calculated that all the stuff you need to make a garand equals about $360(and thats not with ebay but from vendors, this price includes the M14) so why pay 200 extra dollars for labor when you can convert it yourself and save $200?
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Sept 10, 2009 15:10:02 GMT -5
I agree absolutley and enthusiastically. Good luck with the project and I mean that sincerely. If you have the time, inclination and even marginal skill and equipment this is an absolutely worthwhile project and I wish to see as many of them on the airsoft fields as possible.
Keep us posted on your progress.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 2, 2009 2:56:19 GMT -5
I have geared way back in production but continue to receive rather insistant requests and so if time permits and the components continue to be available I will continue to build them. I have just shipped six more and have another batch of six about half way completed. They typically take me 3 to four weeks to complete. If you want one PM me and I'll let you know if I'm still doing them and what the time frame would be. Pricing is still $560.00 which in the interest of full disclosure means I charge the outrageous cost of roughly 275.00 in labor after the materials cost is subtracted out. If that seems exhorbitant you obviously have no clue what's involved in the production and I strongly encourage anyone to build them themselves and save the money I charge. There's no mystery to the process and it's not hard especially but it is time consuming and I feel I have to be compensated at least as much as I'd make working part time at MacDonalds. I still enjoy making them but mostly have enjoyed meeting WW2 airsoft enthusiasts all over the world.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 3, 2009 21:05:21 GMT -5
Incidently I am approaching 300 sales now so if the Chinese are watching clearly there is a market for them!!!!!
I am molding the lower stocks and some other parts which is requiring an expenditure I probably should have extended two years ago. There is some risk involved (Like if it doesn't work!) and it is trickier than I had been led to believe. If it does work, it will allow me to make more of them quicker and will produce a more consistent, higher quality, end product. This will allow me the luxury of marketing them more aggressively. Right now it's all I can do to keep up with the one or two that sell every week.
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Nov 3, 2009 21:10:24 GMT -5
Can't wait to see the results. I am thinking about selling some Garands in limited quantities, much less then you have made. I don't want to sell Flaggrantly Wrong looking stocks but the Bondo is a lot of work as you know. Molding would definitely be way easier. I have no experience with it though. Let us know how it goes.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 4, 2009 1:38:01 GMT -5
The current process as you know (Since you've done it) is extremely labor intense and time consuming. I have stocks currently drying that are now on their third applied layer and will need at least one more layer or coat depending on how they look when sanded. I filed the previous layer into the approximate shape already. Five layers all left to harden and then get rough sanded and filed over the course of a week makes for a lot of work and that's just to do the stock. With the mold I'm hoping to be able to set the base stock into it with the rebar screws in place and then pour in the filler. Once hardened the augmented stock will of course need blending and finish work but it should cut out a ton of time. Naturally it will be a while before I recoup the set up and production costs setting up the molds but once that's done I'll be way ahead of the game. It will slightly increase my materials costs and I'll have to factor in the set up and tooling costs but it should greatly reduce my production time and make for a more consistent finish.
If i get it figured out and it works I'll be delighted, if it doesn't it won't be the first time I ran down an expensive box canyon. I currently have retailers who would love to buy my Garands for resale but even on a sizeable volume purchase I can't discount my costs significantly enough for it to make sense for them.
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Sgt_Tom
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Nov 4, 2009 18:19:21 GMT -5
What kind of filler are you using if you don't mind sharing. Best of luck!
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Nov 8, 2009 19:48:05 GMT -5
There are several possibilities as resins and plastics come in a wide assortment of densities and hardness. I will have to experiement with several before I deteremine what specific product will work best. I need reasonable drying time, sufficient strength, sandability and the ability to accept color while avoiding air bubbles. A lot to ask for in a filler.
The shop I have been getting advice from showed me that you can add mettalic flakes into some plastics and wood fillers that create amazingly strong parts that look and feel just like metal while others supposedly look just like wood. I am definitely looking into that and the possibilities they suggest. Depending on how you make your molds and the materials used in them they have various life spans in terms of how many parts you can draw from them before they are no longer serviceable. All considerations to be factored in. In the meantime I continue to extend the time consuming labor needed to make each gun.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jan 27, 2010 21:24:48 GMT -5
I have produced the first batch of completed rifles using the molds and they came out quite good. The production time is way way down although sales are up so wait times remain constant. The mettalic effects are surprisingly good although naturally compared to the actual parts they naturally fall a bit short (Duh!) The resin handguards are likewise quite nice and blend perfectly with the lower stocks. Everything fits tight and easily so the components as supplied in a do it yourself kit are working very nicely.
I've had requests for individual parts like the molded gas assemblies and while I'm not thrilled about selling individual bits and pieces if it's something you need to finish a project and you need to keep your costs low just let me know. If I have some on hand and un committed at the time of your request I'll shoot you off a quote. (I'm currently thinking $25.00 for the complete gas assembly (molded) 30.00 for the molded handguards (stained, finished and of course pre-shaped and sized to fit on your M14.) The augmented stock piece (which will need blending and paint but will simplify your Garand conversion significantly will likewise be $30.00.
The complete kit component package (minus the base rifle) will cost $145.00 and will include every incidental and tiny item you'll need along with full instructions, stains, filler, brackets etc. Obviously shipping will be well below what a finished rifle will cost.
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Post by CharleyNovember on Jan 27, 2010 21:39:26 GMT -5
145.00!!!!! Holy crap that is an outstanding price for that kit John. NO ONE can or should bitch about they can't afford a Garand now.
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Sgt_Tom
Technical Sgt.
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Post by Sgt_Tom on Jan 27, 2010 21:52:12 GMT -5
Truly wonderful! I'll definitely be telling this to my unit members! I know your busy but whenever you have time to take pictures, I'd love to see them.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jan 28, 2010 1:29:56 GMT -5
The molds make it possible to offer that low of a price as the parts come out pre-shaped and materials costs are quite low. (Assuming I forget about the costs developing the molds) They look amazingly good and it should make for a pretty easy project for everyone. The plan all along has been to encourage as many Garands for the WW2 airsoft fields as possible.
I have taken lots of pictures, it's just a case of downloading onto a hosting site and getting them posted. I have been somewhat swamped with work and have been pressed to complete several standing sold orders (That will go out this week) I have another batch of rifles started as well of which four are pre-sold. I ran out of clips and had to order another large batch in order to complete some backorders and complete existing sales. There are numerous steps in their production that require time to dry. Like so many things they aren't hard but time consuming and labor intense.
I intend to do up some additional stand alone kits although this week I had two folks who are shipping me their rifles to convert. The good news is the assembly manual is pretty much done. I promise to get the pictures posted before the weekend is over.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jan 31, 2010 1:26:30 GMT -5
In answer to some PMs the stock augmentation piece is a solid pre-shaped form that is epoxied to the M14 stock and I then recommend you drill several screws into the augmentation shape from inside the M14 stock to further strengthen the contact and to essentially provide a sort of rebar to the polymere piece. Once dried, I use (or if you're doing the kit) resin paste to smooth out the seams and further complete the Garand shape. The polymere resin paste is provided in the kit with simple instructions. The augmentation piece eliminates the multiple layered series of applications I used to have to do and provides the shape around the mag well that was the most challenging to do and is the most critical. The handguards come out of the mold with incredible detail and look amazing as does the gas assembly. Because they are presized and shaped they require very little alteration and fit beautifully into place with the brackets materials and instructions. The finished rifles with the molded pieces look as good as the full blown deluxe version from 10 feet away. (In my opinion) Depending on what you're able to buy your base M14 for you should be able to do your own Garand conversion for right around $300.00 Here are some of the molded pieces: Augmented piece attached and blended to the M14 stock and stained to match the handguards: The contents of the kit: A completed rifle using all molded parts
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Post by mcnair on Feb 1, 2010 7:29:58 GMT -5
Awesome.
What would the extra cost be(if available)to send the base rifle to you for completion?
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Feb 1, 2010 12:54:34 GMT -5
Just subtract out what I pay for a CYMA M14 which is $125.00 (I buy them in cartons of six)
Hence a Recruit edition plain base rifle would be $425.00 -125 ($300.00) if you sent me your rifle.
The deluxe wood and steel version would be $560.00 - 125 ($435.00) I am doing two that way right now. Both fellows already had their own M14s.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on May 23, 2010 22:23:35 GMT -5
Still another bacth of rifles will ship this week and the next grouping is perhaps five weeks from completion. There are two sold rifles in this current batch pending transfer of funds from overseas. If something falls through they would be immediately available. In addition I shipped three base kits and one deluxe kit this weekend. I have only one currently available but will build up some more kits.
Two stocking issues I currently have is the base clips I need for building the flush mounted magazines. I have enough support the rifle sales (at least for a while) but not enough for the spare combat packs. As soon as they free up I'll build out a couple hundred. In addition I am struggling to get the stacking swivels at a decent price. I refuse to pay $15.00 for such a basic part bought from Ebay!
Unless I can find a volume reasonable source I may have to ship without the stacking swivel and then mail it later. Easy part to put on. I hate backordering anything and naturally would advise anyone ordering prior to transferinmg funds if it is the case.
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2nd Bat
Master sergeant
Posts: 11,813
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Post by 2nd Bat on Jun 4, 2010 0:24:26 GMT -5
All pendings that were scheduled to be done next week were finished over the weekend and shipped this week including a rifle to France and Spain. Just received an order from Denmark which will make three in that small country. I'm estimating the next batch will be complete in 2 to 3 weeks and there are a couple unsold in that group (at present) At this point they could be regular or recruit editions.
I got some wonderful pictures today from customer built rifles using my kits and they look great. One of the builders was 14 years old and did the project entirely on his own. It looks great.
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