Post by lrich on Feb 17, 2009 20:30:24 GMT -5
The M1928R1 (<-R Stands for Richard, as this is the Richard Arms Variant ;D)
Sentimental Crap:
For as long as i can remember, i wanted a Thompson. Then i got into airsofting, and i got a Thompson. Then i thought to myself, i want the m1928, to set me off from the Big5 crowd.
I booted up my trusty Dell, looked for an m1928 and/or kit and nearly fell out of my chair. $300 for a kit? That is more than the rest of my airsoft stuff (at the time, its gone up a little ;D) cost combined. So this idea was shelved.
Then Kapowwe came out with the customer returns Thompson's, and i missed the first run of box deals, so i bided my time, watching and waiting, to get quite a few (i case i really screwed something up i wanted a back up), and finally purchased a set. Bringing them to Sequim, i sat for a second in the Aura of Thompsonness, before getting to work
The Cost Breakdown
Box lot of Thompsons: $125 shipped for 4.5 working ones (i had to take them apart to get the 4 working ones+working lower receiver)
1/8"x1"x3' Aluminum plate: $5
1/16"x1"x3' Aluminum Plate: $4
Random Aluminum bits: $1 from a box o' scraps at a local shop
Epoxy (only the amount i used, to get the massive cans that my dad always has laying around is like $150 total, but you can use that much for forever) ~$10 for 3 guns
8"x2"x8' Plank: $8 (So far, made 3 stocks, 2 foregrips, and i am only halfway through it)
Spray Paint (black and Clear coat):$25 for the 3 guns
PVC: Free (scraps)
Screws+nuts+misc stuff $10 for all 3
Total for the three guns: $188
Cost per gun: $62.63+labor
Keep in mind, i got a great boxdeal on the guns, the gun might be significantly more if you don't buy 5 guns, and roll the dice with having them be working.
The Build
First off, there are no pictures of how i actually built it, i thought i had brought my camera, but sadly, i forgot it, so i'll describe it. Keep in mind, this took me a full three days, working about 10AM-Midnight+prior planning on my free time, to get all of the guns done, and two are still drying at my shop in Sequim (i am in Seattle now for School). That's probably about 12 hours a gun, more like 15 hours for the first, and 11 for the second, 10 for the third. And this was generally all time working, making parts/painting etc, not just sitting waiting for the paint to dry.
Also, i used an ancient Clausinghaus lathe (50+ years old i think), and a Bridgeport milling machine for the machine work, as well as a generic beltsander, genuine Dremel and a Sears bandsaw for the woodwork. I wouldn't recommend trying to build this with simply hand tools (drill, dremel etc), as you would have a really hard time cutting everything accurately enough.
First, i needed to fill in the sides of the gun, so the receiver would be flat, unlike how on the m1a1, the receiver has metal removed, probably to save metal for the war effort.
After completely disassembling the gun, taking off everything, including the sight assembly, i was ready to build two channels for the epoxy.
To accomplish this, i cut a plate to seal the inside of the receiver, and two aluminum plates that extended all the way down the length of the receiver, secured those with clamps, then clamped in two aluminum bars in the front of those, to hold the epoxy from flowing out past the front of the receiver, and also put two plates on the back, following the angle off of the rear. I sealed this all with grease, to keep the epoxy in, and don't forget to rough the surface, for better adhesion.
I taped over the top of the receiver, to prevent epoxy from filling those holes, and/or covering those trades (i couldn't redraw that mini logo) Then, i mixed up the epoxy, and poured it in. I went slowly, so as to minimize air bubbles.
As i had extra epoxy, i used that to fill in the center of the cocking handle
While waiting for that to dry, I started on the sight assembly. That was simple, i just clamped it, dropped the milling machine down until i thought the top was the right height, and milled both sides. Then i milled the front part, so as to not have it simply drop off, but instead slope down. Not 100% accurate, but a lot cheaper, simpler, and easier. Turning it on its side, i cut out the depressions on the sides, that have on function other than to annoy the average machinist.
Next, i moved onto the barrel. This was the tricky part, in an effort to save metal (money), the barrel is hollow, so i needed to be precise. Clamping it in the lathe, and jamming the live center in the other end for stability, i used the little knobs to cut in .050 inch every .300 inches. I did this by eye, going far enough as i see on the pictures (as in, until the barrel stops tapering).
Finally, the epoxy was dry, now on to some fun metal cutting! Now i had no place for the cocking handle, and i needed one. So simply i used a 3/8" cutter, as that was the one that was just wide enough for the handle assembly. Using the length and placement of the original handle hole, i milled out the hole, and filed it smooth. Meanwhile, i cut off a bit of the boltplate, for it to fit nicely on the top of the receiver.
Testing for fit, i found out that the gearbox nearly touches the top, too little room for the plate. So to solve that, i flipped the receiver over, and clamped the the bugger, and taking a 3/4" cutter, milled out about .090" for clearance. Now it slide nicely. However, be careful, so as to not accidentally mill out the spring attachment point (my mistake on my first one, the next two, it is fine).
By now, i had enough parts, so i threw them on some cardboard, and sprayed them down with their first coat of paint. I put about 5 layers of black, and 3 layers of clearcoat on each, so as to increase the durability, since i can't get my hands on a more professional paint set up (yet...)
Next, the stock.
I simply used my m1a1 stock as a guide, and modified it how i see the m1928 one is modified. I didn't put in the reinforcing nut part, as i didn't have a spare one to use, but some Thompson's don't, so it works.
Cutting that out on the bandsaw, i got a rough shape, and then used the belt sander to round and smooth the edges, until i got something i about liked, then used 80 and 150 grit, to make it high quality.
I then clamped it vertical on the milling machine, used a 1 inch drill to drill out a battery space, and an impressively long .375 drill to cut a hole through the stock for the wires. No battery bags for me ;D. Also, do this slowly, or the drill comes out hot enough to burn fingers (and make water you toss on it flash to steam
)
For the foregrip, that was nearly free hand (originals are ~$40 wherever i look), using the pistol grip for a guide. It came out surprisingly accurate. I used a fly cutter to make the grip a little thinner (1inch, vs 1.5 inches wide) I used a dremel using sanding drums to get the approximate curves and finger parts, then used sandpaper to smooth it out.
Tossed these on some cardboard, and hit them with golden oak stain.
Now, since i cut off the underbarrel mount so i could rib the barrel (and becuase the m1928 doesn't have it attached), i needed a way to attach that beautiful foregrip.
That is where the 1/8" aluminum comes in. I simply cut an approximately 8 inch length, drilled a hole in it for the screw to hold the grip, and another two holes for the screws to screw it to the receiver, sanded the edge a little for fitting issues, and threw it down and painted it.
This is where i realized that i wanted a nuts to increase the steadyness of the grip attachment (there was barely any threading in the aluminum, due to its width). Well hell, turns out my parents had ordered pizza, so i got the money for the nuts
.
Now it was approaching completion, all i really needed was a Cutts compensator (no Gangster would be caught without one :
. So i used scrap PVC, taking a one inch piece, and gluing a 3/4 inch piece in it, to downsize it a little, facing it off, and giving the front a little bevel, i took it off the lathe, put it on the milling machine, cut the ports on top, and cut a place so i could slip it on the barrel. It is simply pressure fit, but has no real chance to fall off (i put a drop of superglue on mine, as i plan on skirmishing it, and don't want a tree taking it off for me).
The final thing was to make the slot for the drum, i tried it, i came out OK, but not the greatest, it will work, but i'll have to work on it later.
Now all i had to do was wait, and after the gun was dry, i took it out, assembled it, and it looks pretty damn good. All i have now are some 20 round mags i CNC'ed, though it looks nice, i really want a drum. My next project is to build a kit that i can drop in Thompson high cap internals into (and maybe sell that, along with some m1928's ;D), and after that, a 500 round C drum Low cap (Spiral the rounds around, it just might work, Radius of 9 inches, so circumfrence of ~28 inches, i need 120 inches, so only 5 turns around and i should be good).
Assembly:
Its a snap, just as easy as before, just put everything back on in reverse order. Nothing Hard there. Only extra step was to attach the handgrip to the plate, then attach the plate to the receiver, i find this is much easier than trying to tighten the nut when it is on the gun.
Historical Inaccuracies:
I know it isn't perfect, but i believe this would pass the 5 foot test, and probably the "non WWII aficionado holding it" test.
There is no Lyman Sight. Wayy to much work, would probably take me another whole day of working
The "ears" aren't 100% accurate, but since this is somewhat of a "budget build" the way i did it, i think they look pretty realistic from a little ways off, and even up close, unless you know exactly how the real ones go.
Cutts compensator is not secured by a pin. Who really cares that much? Well someone might, so i figure i should point this out.
Cocking handle isn't knurled. I didn't want to risk breaking it by trying to do that. Also, for this one, i accidentally used a endmill, not a ball cutter, so it isn't a U cut out, more a box.
Receiver is flat sided until the beginning of the magwell, and then blended in. The real one it is blended after the magwell. I did this as it present infinitely less problems.
Stock and Foregrip might be off. I didn't have an original, so i had to go by pictures. Therefore it might not be perfect.
Barrel is not ribbed far enough. In the real one, the ribs are pretty deep, i couldn't do that, due to the design of the barrel. It would have cost me $50+ and lots of work to get a piece of aluminum of the proper diameter, and then machine it down.
I don't know about the buttplate. Right now, i left it in Sequim, but it is basically a piece of bent aluminum, as i can't find an example of the real one, and the wood wasn't strong enough to take the one from the plastic stock.
No Trades on the sides. I fried my engraver, so i am working on procuring a new one, and remedying this.
No Sling Swivels. Why would you want to sling up such a beauty?
Do You Want One?
I was thinking of selling some of these (i only have Two hands, an currently 6 Thompsons), i was thinking ~$200 per gun. My reasoning is thus: your getting a fully working Thompson, which retails for $150 ($110+shipping the cheapest), with a custom set up, requiring about 10 hours of work, which billed at $10 and hour (cheapish), works out to be about $100. I then take off some money as it wouldn't include a mag and battery ($20, as the battery is a cheap one, and the mag is cheap off of Kapowwe), and since i got the guns cheaper (i bought in bulk, and had to assemble working guns from non working ones). What are your thoughts? Post them here please.
More Pictures
Just sitting there with some magazines, in all its glory. The finish is a little less shiny than the pictures, but my camera does that.
The Ribbing, you want to see these ribs, unlike those of Lindsey...
Also, the block under the attachment point for the grip is the magazine bottom, not some deformity (even though at first it looks like it). If i didn't put that under there, the gun would sink down, and you wouldn't be able to see it very well.
No trades
, but you can see the rear sight protection thing pretty well. Also, notice the slot for the drum. Not the best, but i'll improve it.
The Top, notice the bolt cut out isn't quite a U, more of a block. Also, under this light, you can see where the epoxy meets the metal. I cranked up the light in this one, so you could see how i did it, in real life, you can't barely see it.
Beauty Shot.
Sorry for the lack of outdoor pictures. Both becuase it is pretty cold and dead, and there are way to nosy people who would freak if they saw me out with this kept those out of this thread.
Hope you like it,
Luke
P.S. if you have read all of this, you have read over 2,000 words, if not, well, then, i understand, the pictures are more fun.
And sorry, no pictures of me with it, in a pinstripe suit (yes, i have one), because my mom is paranoid about me+pictures with guns, and i don't have anyone else to take pictures for me.
Other pictures can be taken on request, just ask if you are interested, i just couldn't think of any more
Sentimental Crap:
For as long as i can remember, i wanted a Thompson. Then i got into airsofting, and i got a Thompson. Then i thought to myself, i want the m1928, to set me off from the Big5 crowd.
I booted up my trusty Dell, looked for an m1928 and/or kit and nearly fell out of my chair. $300 for a kit? That is more than the rest of my airsoft stuff (at the time, its gone up a little ;D) cost combined. So this idea was shelved.
Then Kapowwe came out with the customer returns Thompson's, and i missed the first run of box deals, so i bided my time, watching and waiting, to get quite a few (i case i really screwed something up i wanted a back up), and finally purchased a set. Bringing them to Sequim, i sat for a second in the Aura of Thompsonness, before getting to work
The Cost Breakdown
Box lot of Thompsons: $125 shipped for 4.5 working ones (i had to take them apart to get the 4 working ones+working lower receiver)
1/8"x1"x3' Aluminum plate: $5
1/16"x1"x3' Aluminum Plate: $4
Random Aluminum bits: $1 from a box o' scraps at a local shop
Epoxy (only the amount i used, to get the massive cans that my dad always has laying around is like $150 total, but you can use that much for forever) ~$10 for 3 guns
8"x2"x8' Plank: $8 (So far, made 3 stocks, 2 foregrips, and i am only halfway through it)
Spray Paint (black and Clear coat):$25 for the 3 guns
PVC: Free (scraps)
Screws+nuts+misc stuff $10 for all 3
Total for the three guns: $188
Cost per gun: $62.63+labor
Keep in mind, i got a great boxdeal on the guns, the gun might be significantly more if you don't buy 5 guns, and roll the dice with having them be working.
The Build
First off, there are no pictures of how i actually built it, i thought i had brought my camera, but sadly, i forgot it, so i'll describe it. Keep in mind, this took me a full three days, working about 10AM-Midnight+prior planning on my free time, to get all of the guns done, and two are still drying at my shop in Sequim (i am in Seattle now for School). That's probably about 12 hours a gun, more like 15 hours for the first, and 11 for the second, 10 for the third. And this was generally all time working, making parts/painting etc, not just sitting waiting for the paint to dry.
Also, i used an ancient Clausinghaus lathe (50+ years old i think), and a Bridgeport milling machine for the machine work, as well as a generic beltsander, genuine Dremel and a Sears bandsaw for the woodwork. I wouldn't recommend trying to build this with simply hand tools (drill, dremel etc), as you would have a really hard time cutting everything accurately enough.
First, i needed to fill in the sides of the gun, so the receiver would be flat, unlike how on the m1a1, the receiver has metal removed, probably to save metal for the war effort.
After completely disassembling the gun, taking off everything, including the sight assembly, i was ready to build two channels for the epoxy.
To accomplish this, i cut a plate to seal the inside of the receiver, and two aluminum plates that extended all the way down the length of the receiver, secured those with clamps, then clamped in two aluminum bars in the front of those, to hold the epoxy from flowing out past the front of the receiver, and also put two plates on the back, following the angle off of the rear. I sealed this all with grease, to keep the epoxy in, and don't forget to rough the surface, for better adhesion.
I taped over the top of the receiver, to prevent epoxy from filling those holes, and/or covering those trades (i couldn't redraw that mini logo) Then, i mixed up the epoxy, and poured it in. I went slowly, so as to minimize air bubbles.
As i had extra epoxy, i used that to fill in the center of the cocking handle
While waiting for that to dry, I started on the sight assembly. That was simple, i just clamped it, dropped the milling machine down until i thought the top was the right height, and milled both sides. Then i milled the front part, so as to not have it simply drop off, but instead slope down. Not 100% accurate, but a lot cheaper, simpler, and easier. Turning it on its side, i cut out the depressions on the sides, that have on function other than to annoy the average machinist.
Next, i moved onto the barrel. This was the tricky part, in an effort to save metal (money), the barrel is hollow, so i needed to be precise. Clamping it in the lathe, and jamming the live center in the other end for stability, i used the little knobs to cut in .050 inch every .300 inches. I did this by eye, going far enough as i see on the pictures (as in, until the barrel stops tapering).
Finally, the epoxy was dry, now on to some fun metal cutting! Now i had no place for the cocking handle, and i needed one. So simply i used a 3/8" cutter, as that was the one that was just wide enough for the handle assembly. Using the length and placement of the original handle hole, i milled out the hole, and filed it smooth. Meanwhile, i cut off a bit of the boltplate, for it to fit nicely on the top of the receiver.
Testing for fit, i found out that the gearbox nearly touches the top, too little room for the plate. So to solve that, i flipped the receiver over, and clamped the the bugger, and taking a 3/4" cutter, milled out about .090" for clearance. Now it slide nicely. However, be careful, so as to not accidentally mill out the spring attachment point (my mistake on my first one, the next two, it is fine).
By now, i had enough parts, so i threw them on some cardboard, and sprayed them down with their first coat of paint. I put about 5 layers of black, and 3 layers of clearcoat on each, so as to increase the durability, since i can't get my hands on a more professional paint set up (yet...)
Next, the stock.
I simply used my m1a1 stock as a guide, and modified it how i see the m1928 one is modified. I didn't put in the reinforcing nut part, as i didn't have a spare one to use, but some Thompson's don't, so it works.
Cutting that out on the bandsaw, i got a rough shape, and then used the belt sander to round and smooth the edges, until i got something i about liked, then used 80 and 150 grit, to make it high quality.
I then clamped it vertical on the milling machine, used a 1 inch drill to drill out a battery space, and an impressively long .375 drill to cut a hole through the stock for the wires. No battery bags for me ;D. Also, do this slowly, or the drill comes out hot enough to burn fingers (and make water you toss on it flash to steam
)For the foregrip, that was nearly free hand (originals are ~$40 wherever i look), using the pistol grip for a guide. It came out surprisingly accurate. I used a fly cutter to make the grip a little thinner (1inch, vs 1.5 inches wide) I used a dremel using sanding drums to get the approximate curves and finger parts, then used sandpaper to smooth it out.
Tossed these on some cardboard, and hit them with golden oak stain.
Now, since i cut off the underbarrel mount so i could rib the barrel (and becuase the m1928 doesn't have it attached), i needed a way to attach that beautiful foregrip.
That is where the 1/8" aluminum comes in. I simply cut an approximately 8 inch length, drilled a hole in it for the screw to hold the grip, and another two holes for the screws to screw it to the receiver, sanded the edge a little for fitting issues, and threw it down and painted it.
This is where i realized that i wanted a nuts to increase the steadyness of the grip attachment (there was barely any threading in the aluminum, due to its width). Well hell, turns out my parents had ordered pizza, so i got the money for the nuts
. Now it was approaching completion, all i really needed was a Cutts compensator (no Gangster would be caught without one :
. So i used scrap PVC, taking a one inch piece, and gluing a 3/4 inch piece in it, to downsize it a little, facing it off, and giving the front a little bevel, i took it off the lathe, put it on the milling machine, cut the ports on top, and cut a place so i could slip it on the barrel. It is simply pressure fit, but has no real chance to fall off (i put a drop of superglue on mine, as i plan on skirmishing it, and don't want a tree taking it off for me). The final thing was to make the slot for the drum, i tried it, i came out OK, but not the greatest, it will work, but i'll have to work on it later.
Now all i had to do was wait, and after the gun was dry, i took it out, assembled it, and it looks pretty damn good. All i have now are some 20 round mags i CNC'ed, though it looks nice, i really want a drum. My next project is to build a kit that i can drop in Thompson high cap internals into (and maybe sell that, along with some m1928's ;D), and after that, a 500 round C drum Low cap
(Spiral the rounds around, it just might work, Radius of 9 inches, so circumfrence of ~28 inches, i need 120 inches, so only 5 turns around and i should be good). Assembly:
Its a snap, just as easy as before, just put everything back on in reverse order. Nothing Hard there. Only extra step was to attach the handgrip to the plate, then attach the plate to the receiver, i find this is much easier than trying to tighten the nut when it is on the gun.
Historical Inaccuracies:
I know it isn't perfect, but i believe this would pass the 5 foot test, and probably the "non WWII aficionado holding it" test.
There is no Lyman Sight. Wayy to much work, would probably take me another whole day of working
The "ears" aren't 100% accurate, but since this is somewhat of a "budget build" the way i did it, i think they look pretty realistic from a little ways off, and even up close, unless you know exactly how the real ones go.
Cutts compensator is not secured by a pin. Who really cares that much? Well someone might, so i figure i should point this out.
Cocking handle isn't knurled. I didn't want to risk breaking it by trying to do that. Also, for this one, i accidentally used a endmill, not a ball cutter, so it isn't a U cut out, more a box.
Receiver is flat sided until the beginning of the magwell, and then blended in. The real one it is blended after the magwell. I did this as it present infinitely less problems.
Stock and Foregrip might be off. I didn't have an original, so i had to go by pictures. Therefore it might not be perfect.
Barrel is not ribbed far enough. In the real one, the ribs are pretty deep, i couldn't do that, due to the design of the barrel. It would have cost me $50+ and lots of work to get a piece of aluminum of the proper diameter, and then machine it down.
I don't know about the buttplate. Right now, i left it in Sequim, but it is basically a piece of bent aluminum, as i can't find an example of the real one, and the wood wasn't strong enough to take the one from the plastic stock.
No Trades on the sides. I fried my engraver, so i am working on procuring a new one, and remedying this.
No Sling Swivels. Why would you want to sling up such a beauty?
Do You Want One?
I was thinking of selling some of these (i only have Two hands, an currently 6 Thompsons), i was thinking ~$200 per gun. My reasoning is thus: your getting a fully working Thompson, which retails for $150 ($110+shipping the cheapest), with a custom set up, requiring about 10 hours of work, which billed at $10 and hour (cheapish), works out to be about $100. I then take off some money as it wouldn't include a mag and battery ($20, as the battery is a cheap one, and the mag is cheap off of Kapowwe), and since i got the guns cheaper (i bought in bulk, and had to assemble working guns from non working ones). What are your thoughts? Post them here please.
More Pictures
Just sitting there with some magazines, in all its glory. The finish is a little less shiny than the pictures, but my camera does that.
The Ribbing, you want to see these ribs, unlike those of Lindsey...
Also, the block under the attachment point for the grip is the magazine bottom, not some deformity (even though at first it looks like it). If i didn't put that under there, the gun would sink down, and you wouldn't be able to see it very well.
No trades
, but you can see the rear sight protection thing pretty well. Also, notice the slot for the drum. Not the best, but i'll improve it. The Top, notice the bolt cut out isn't quite a U, more of a block. Also, under this light, you can see where the epoxy meets the metal. I cranked up the light in this one, so you could see how i did it, in real life, you can't barely see it.
Beauty Shot.
Sorry for the lack of outdoor pictures. Both becuase it is pretty cold and dead, and there are way to nosy people who would freak if they saw me out with this kept those out of this thread.
Hope you like it,
Luke
P.S. if you have read all of this, you have read over 2,000 words, if not, well, then, i understand, the pictures are more fun.
And sorry, no pictures of me with it, in a pinstripe suit (yes, i have one), because my mom is paranoid about me+pictures with guns, and i don't have anyone else to take pictures for me.
Other pictures can be taken on request, just ask if you are interested, i just couldn't think of any more
)
. This wasn't supposed to be a sale thread. 
