ANM2 .30 Stinger Project.

[killbucket]

The stock design. We will be using woodgrain stocks. The rest of the gun is just a 1919. We are working on the ANM2 sideplates now.

[mikkel]

OMG what a monster!

Nice job!

[YankeeDiv26]

wow, awesome looking killbucket.

[jimseery]

Looks great! Are you going to supply a carry handle and bipod? If not can you narrow the cooling shroud to accomodate BAR substitutes?

[2nd Bat]

The BAR carry handle fits perfectly over the inner barrel so you could simply cut a slit in the outer housing up at the front of receiver. I noticed on the stinger picture shown the handle was facing forward where it was rear facing on the 1919A6. Forward facing probably is more practical. I'm tempted to do a stinger instead of a M191A6 but of course the A6 was more common. Still I have so many M-14 stocks that it seems I'd putting to use items I have. The bipod is also an easier design.

[TommyGunner]

Wow that is really great looking, phenominal so far, maybe after I get your M1917 Ill buy the parts needed for making a stinger to go with my USMC impressions. I feel good that at least once that I or (all WW2 USMC airsofters) have the one up on the ETO guys becuase we have the impressions necesary to go with such a theater and in some cases battle specific weapon. What a lollipops !

TommyGunner

[killbucket]

The drawing of the ANM2 Stinger is completed, I will be cutting the prototype parts today. The side-mounted ammo box is constructed, as is the insert that holds the ammodrive and over 10,000 6mm's (!). There is plenty of room for a second battery pack (double amperage available!) in the ammo bin.
This is going to be about 16 pounds complete when finished. The receiver itself is nearly 18 inches long, I have gone slightly over stock dim's for added effect. If only I could get Arnold to pose with the finished article.
We will also do the ANM2 as a tripod-mounted offering. Speaking of tripods, I have created a new design that is taller, and has a much-increased load bearing capacity. We may offer this as a product in its own right.
As for the Stinger's bipod, we have decided that the style from the hollywood version will be a better choice, as this photo is the one representing the story for the larger part. Note that the smaller photos show the legs parallel for a few inches, then bent apart. the "Hollywood" gun has an A6 bipod lug arrangement. The legs do not fold, but they are removeable. We will mimic this in our design, using steel conduit for the legs.
The barrel will be our standard model we use on the 1919's, with a unique drill pattern like the one in the photo. The barrel on this model will thread on and off realistically, and will freely roll about 20 degrees in the bipod mount, like the original.
I am contemplating the carry handle, it will have the configuration seen on the "hollywood" gun, facing forward.
I've been looking for a good reason to buy a lathe...

[2nd Bat]

Sounds great. I'm looking forward to the pictures. Even with the tripod mounted versions I'm attracted to the notion of an attached box magazine and further like the bipod from an airsoft skirmish perspective.

You're probably amassing a large numer of take off M-14 stocks as am I. For the sake of realism you might want to remove the M-14 butt plate flap and fill in the slots and refinsh to make it more Garand like. The Butt plate flap however is nice feature on a crew served MG so it's obviously not a big deal .

[killbucket]

I'll risk sounding completely un-informed to stop and ask a question or two myself:
What purpose does the butt flap serve? I like how it looks on there.
I should leave a thing or two for customers to improve, esp. if it keeps the item affordable for everybody. Have you made a molded insert up, that you can just bond in and smooth? It seems time-intensive to do the fill/smooth thing with raw putty. I imagine the butt flap adds some durability and offense appeal of its own...
"...look, you can beat a man to death with the stock, and it hardly shows" -Excited russian soldier describing his beloved AK to a Shotgun News writer.

And the term: "Burp Gun", as to describe the Sten and the M3A1. I can find no written origins of this term. Are we talking about open bolt firing, or blowback operation?

[2nd Bat]

The butt flap originated on the BAR which was intended to be fired from a bipod although most GIs disgarded them due to the weight. It rests on the shoulder with the non firing hand resting on the butt stock itself holding it down pressing the butt stock against the top of the shoulder for stability. The M14 was a hybrid of the BAR and Garand (Frankly much closer to the Garand then the BAR but the box magazine and butt plate flap were carried over.

Removing the butt plate and flap and then filling the hollow slots created with resin followed by filing, sanding and paint work is somewhat labor intense but not too bad when you're doing a bunch of them at once. In doing so you can create a more authentic Garand look. Very minor visual enhancement but significant to some people who for example complain that my conversion has a receiver group that is 1/4" shorter then a Garand. As you no doubt are discovering this audience can be quite particular about details.

Burp gun was originally directed toward the MP40 I believe due to it's rate of fire sounding like a burp. I never heard of the M3 being called a burp gun I thought it's only nickname was the Greasegun or Greaser.

[killbucket]

I've noticed that those aren't the same people actually buying guns.
1919A4's do not have spade grips unless they've been customized. But that is all people are ordering now.
That 1/4 inch is a good reason not to own something...hilarious concept. But offer to add the 1/4" at actual cost? ...Nothin' but crickets.
Great info on the flap. I'll leave them on to give the customizers something to remove. The A6 stock had a similar function, so it makes sense to have the feature. "Historically possible"
Progress:

The camera angle makes the ammo bin look bigger than it is.

[2nd Bat]

Killbucket that looks awesome. I think you will do quite well with it even though it was a limited production in real life. The bitt plate flap is actually quite functional with a bipod weapon when in a prone position for long periods of time. As you said anyone who has an issue with it can easily rmove it.

I'm glad you pointed out that the ammo box isn't to scale. That looked frighteningly large! I like the way you ventilated it like the original box. I have decided to build one as well as a M1919A6 just cause they're both so cool.

[2nd Bat]

I see you posted on Arnies and Airsoft News. That should get some response.

[killbucket]

Yes, big shipments going out this weekend, finally.
The switch to electronic fire control delayed a few things. But, the guns fire freakishly faster with so much less resitance, and switches should last about forever now.
The Stinger is a benificiary of the 1919's development cycle, just as the real guns were, about 100 years ago. So much of the design philosophy carried right over. Otherwise, the Stinger would just be too costly to produce. Actually, the process was very straightforward, the assembly is the same, the shapes are different.
I have no doubt that I'm NOT the first to replicate this particular item. It would be its own "Labor" if production wasn't the studied goal in mind.
We are toying with the idea of a Stinger stock option for the 1919's, but feel it would compete with the ANM2 version and possibly create some market confusion.

[recoilrob]

I have long believed that the origin of 'burp-gun' was during the Korean war when GI's first encountered PPSH-41's and their extremely rapid rate of fire. MP-40's actually don't fire very fast.....500rpm or so. Only sub-guns that fire slower are M3 Grease-gun and the various Stens. At least AFAIK.

Someone might have called the MG-42 a burp-gun as its' cyclic rate is about the same as the PaPaSha but I haven't been able to find any historical reference to that. First mention of the phrase 'burp-gun' is normally connected to that alluring Russian bullet hose.

Nice work on the Stingers there Killbucket!

[killbucket]

www.rt66.com/~korteng/SmallArms/ppsh41.html
Good call. I think it was my favorite publication, Shotgun News, had an article referring to the M3 and the Sten particularly as such.

and this:
www.yourdictionary.com/ahd/b/b0566100.html
Considered a generic term, evidently.
If you scroll the page down, an excellent write-up on the PPSH:
www.answers.com/topic/burp-gun
Fires from open bolt. I bet that's the key feature.

[mccallion]

awsome
-mccallion

[killbucket]

Got a bit more done. Please burn your monitor after looking at this spy-photo. Note the shiny stock, lower picatinny on the M14. Not all are like this.
Today is the "Let it run till battery death or component destruction" test day. I'm going to find out what happens if you just hold the trigger mercilessly. The new MOSFET triggering system I designed has seen some long bursts, some I wouldn't want to wait out.
-But I haven't yet just let one run continuously.
I'm going to use one of the chumpy 1200Mah batts that come with the M14's. My reasoning is the low available power density will keep the fire small, and the likelihood of more than 1200 Mah's being there is nada. A full pull to battery death should give me a good indication of the gun's actual power consumption. On paper my components can survive, but the actual amp drain of the Chaoli motors is unknown at this point.
We'll see...
EDIT: "Let It Run Test" is complete!
Testing the AirSharp AEG's MOSFET Fire Control System

Criteria:
Test is to determine our new standard MOSFET fire control electronics durability under sustained fire.
Project goal is a two-minute firing burst without break, to simulate a stressed action use.

Items used:
1200Mah, 8.4v NiCd battery. Fully charged, peak reading is 9.4v at test start.
Stripped AGM M14 with barrel and hop attatched.
Small countdown timer set at 6 minutes.
No ammo used for test.
A fire extinguisher and insulated wire cutters were staged for use if required.
A small hand clamp was used to hold the standard trigger switch into the "ON" position.

Testing:
The switch was clamped on, and the timer started. The gun is running at full chat from this point on.

One minute. The gun hasn't slowed, the voltage has dropped to 8.7v. The heatsink is getting warm.

Two minutes. Gun has slowed slightly, voltage at 8.2v. The heatsink is too hot to touch for more than a instant.

Three minutes. Gun is running steady, the voltage is somewhat stabilized around 6.4v. Water boils off the heatsink.

Four Minutes. Gun has gone down to a steady drone, about two-thirds initial speed. Voltage at 6.0v.

Five minutes, 34 seconds. Gun comes to a halt. Battery pack voltage at 5.4volts. Heatsink is still very hot, water dances on it and vaporizes instantly.

Test Results:
1. The overall design is a success.
2. A sustained, unbroken firing burst of over five minutes was acheived, and was terminated due to depletion of the battery pack.
3. The test run was 250% of the design and test goal.
4. No damage to the gun, wiring, PCB, or battery pack were noted after cool-down.
Thermal Issues:
The MOSFET has been replaced with a model having 300% more capacity, and a re-test showed no heating at all. The heatsink is mounted to the gearbox for added cooling, away from the customer, inside the unit while in use.

All customers who have received anything with a switch on it have been sent a replacement fire control with the MOSFET setup free.

An Important side note:
The AGM base gun is just fine! This is the same test gun/gearbox used in all of our videos, it has not been apart or seen ANY servicing. The original plastic bushings are still in place and amazingly, still look great. The gearbox has no more noise than when new.
I have purchased shims and bushings for this gun, when time permits, I will autopsy the gearset to see if everything is really OK.

If you see somebody carrying one of our guns, be nice to him. If you are using one, please be humane.


My terrible math skills say this thing averaged 14.4amps draw for the test duration. 1200Mah were consumed in 5.5 minutes.

[2nd Bat]

Great test and fine report. Like you I have been enormously impressed with these AGM M-14s. The stinger is going to look awesome. Incidently we have the same Mud Room tile. Is that strange or what?

[killbucket]

My world-famous kitchen floor. The only problem is you drop anything on it, it dissappears. And more than once I've tried to scrub a "stain" that was part of the pattern...

[2nd Bat]

If my long haired first sgt ever saw any of my guns in HER kitchen I'd be KIA. She's upset enough seeing them in the mud room. This Winter when I was drying stain for a group of them in the mud room sink she was not happy.

I try to keep it all in my work area in the garage.

[killbucket]

I've taken over about 40% of a four bedroom home. Money talks.
Xanax helps.

[killbucket]

Have the proto assembled and terrorizing the backyard with it. It's clear that one or more of the batteries (!) will need to go into the gun body for better balance. The ammo bin with a full load is enough weight on its own.
Deciding on where the strap mounts should be. I do not know if the originals had any type of sling, but ours will, and have a nice strong one with metal hard ware included. Before anybody asks, this won't be a "tactical sling", on a 54" gun, it would be impractical. Ours will be a standard shoulder sling.

[2nd Bat]

I can guarantee you that a sling was improvised on the real gun and soldiers and Marines in theater would figure out a way. It would probably be quite similar to what you come up with.

[Obergefreiter Raimund]

The Gun Looks Great!

Nice test results btw

[jimseery]

Turkey trots to water xx When will it be ready xx The world wonders?

[killbucket]

These will be shipping in JULY.
Updated photos coming soon of the prototype.
We've been busy filling 1919 orders, but this has come along in the development.
The airsoft world's gonna suddenly find a use for all those noob sniper-wannabe's.
A Stinger will fire all day with no consideration for batteries or ammunition. You won't get dead-ified while winding a hicap.
The only thing that stops a Stinger is Mercy.
Hmmm...that could be tagline.

[armourer4]

hi killbucket
what date in july as ive ordered one

[killbucket]

And you got into the first batch of ten units made. These will ship in less than two weeks. The Guns will use two battery packs, you want a pair of these:

www.all-battery.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1721
The gun will run on a single, the system uses them in parallel for a nice steady firing rate on long bursts. If you're planning a long day, 7600maH should be plenty.
A few bucks more will get you up to 9000maH:

Technical note:
In building an experimental 16volt (!) gun, with the batteries in series, we learned a few things.
Firing rate doesn't increase in proportion as expected. We are specifying 7 cell packs, but 8 cells (9.6volts nominal) is a sweet spot, I'm sure others have reached the same conclusion. I'll let the Japanese enthusiasts push that envelope.
Next, for the test rig, instead of a MOSFET switch, I used a 40 amp continuous-duty automotive horn relay (so the setup could be suitably abused, and be useful for testing other items).
Long story short, everything that leaves the shop from this point forward will have this setup. It is flat-out bulletproof. 'FET's are great for pistols, because they are small and easier to hide. And a whole bunch of math on amp draw/heat dissipation just went away.

The relay greatly simplifies the layout and wiring for the gun and its accessories. To pass this on to the customer, we have rolled back our recent price change, making a complete gun cost ten dollars less in components, than it previously did complete.

[killbucket]

YeeHaw can you beat on these things now!
I added an active brake circuit, the gun goes DEAD when you let go of the trigger now. You can feel the motor lock after each full-auto string, it adds a nice element.
I'll have new pics of the dual-battery powered prototype up in the very next few days. With the clean on/off and a theoretical 60 amps on tap, this is the most responsive gun I've handled. It doesn't seem to accelerate so much, it seems to instantly go to full speed...and stop. Freaky.
I feel like Dr. Frankenstien himself. I've created a monster with this one.
Have all the goodies to hotrod the gearbox in one of these, Classic Army Stainless gearset, new shims, 180% spring, metal bearing spring guide. I've rounded up a madbull tightbore barrel meant for a PSG-1 to put in.